GWC Podcast #106

Podcasts Galactic Watercooler
#61

C3PO had a British voice and he was comic relief. I do not think that was a slap in the face the British people. Maybe the actor was just good for the part?

Just look at the Imperials from the OT. Lucas isn’t suggesting Britain is a tyrannical Empire is he? :stuck_out_tongue:

ps. on a personal note, we welcomed our daughter Trillian Josephine into the world on June 4th, 2008. Her parents will do everthing in their power to bring her up with as much sci-fi as possible!

Congratulations Dave :slight_smile:

I only do the movies so I had no idea there was an attempt in the EU to make the Gungans less useless, that’s really interesting. A re-evaluation of the effect that the characters in the movie had?

Besides being a marketing tool, GL uses the EU to explain what he couldn’t in the confines of the movies. He has a very strong hand in directing what creators can and can’t do in his universe. There is a massive amount of retconning in the EU.

PLEASE DON’T PEE IN THE GOO

Well, you know some of us probably do anyways. We just don’t tell anyone. :smiley:

And you guys are so right - to all you gutter-men, she knows what you’re up to! Muwahahaha. What does objectification become when the revered object is aware of said objectification?

Do we need to have the bionic crotch debate again? :wink:

aarrgghyle that was a fantastic post. I agree with your Yoda begot Dooku begot Qui-Gon etc. analogy.

You know what makes me really, really happy? That I’m not the one who brought up ethnic stereotyping in Star Wars!!! Mwa ha ha ha ha. (I totally agree with what Chuck was saying about it, but alas, I shall luxuriate in the Also Not Me jacuzzi.) (Sorry, Chuck.)

I am probably to blame for that. (sorry Barb) I made a silly off hand comment in the Ep.1 frak party thread about how I wondered what you’d think about the SW stereotypes. Then I had to explain the JarJar stereotype.

#62

Great comments, indeed! I’d be interested on an expanded discussion of peoples opinions on why Luke is one that is able to break the cycle (or should we wait until Eps 4-6?). I should also must provide the caveat that I’m only going on the movies and have very little experience with the EU. I find it interesting that while Anakin/Vader that possessed the power to defeat the Emperor, it was only Luke who could actually channel that power to its ultimate purpose.

Was Luke better adjusted because over time both Obiwan and Yoda learned from their past mentoring mistakes? Or despite their concerns did Luke actually benefit from entering the Jedi training so late? Given Count Duku and Anakin it appears that good Jedi training is no guarantee against turning to the dark side. Maybe while Luke didn’t have the Jedi power of the others it was his unrepressed humanity that kept him from turning to the dark side?

#63

So I got through the podcast…

Yay! You played my call! I’m definitely an eternal BSG optimist - c’mon, every time I re-watch an episode I see something new. Consider the rewatching possibilities while we wait! What new knowledge will be revealed… though dude I didn’t realize I talk so fast on the phone. Sorry about that.

THOMAS THE TANK ENGINE! I think George Carlin was actually the conductor. I was a bit old for it, but my younger siblings were totally into it.

re: Shmi and Anakin’s virgin birth. I considered the idea while we were frak partying it up with AOTC, but seriously, no wonder Anakin and Padme have kids. Anakin has no idea how it works!

The Seven Degrees of the Dark Side is pure awesomeness, Chuck. Of course we’ve all had the fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate… leads to suffering! (ears down) shoved down our throats so many times… and suffering… leads to the DarkSide?

I’m not a serious gamer at all, but I love Lego Star Wars (and the Battlefront games), and you’re right about the Bantha. It takes so much time to figure it out, and then you try to ride it somewhere and it falls off a cliff. But it’s so worth it.

re: JarJar=Sisko. Emily, Audra’s right. There is no comparing Sisko to Jar Jar. That just hurts.

re: how to watch the series. Considering I asked in the first place… :rolleyes: I usually re-watch 1-6, because I actually like the prequels! But it does make Luke really obnoxious. I hear everyone complaining about Anakin, but seriously, he has nothing on his progeny.

And just to reiterate… GRACE PARK! OMG! That was the coolest thing ever.

#64

i wrote a research paper last semester on the role of race in sci-fi TV/film, including stuff about BSG, Star Wars, and Star Trek. i found some interesting stuff regarding the stereotypes in Episode I (most notably the Nemoidians as Asians and Watto as Jewish/Middle Eastern).

a professor in London conducted experiments with his students by having them view the film. after watching the movie, one group was given reviews of the film which highlighted the supposed stereotypes in the film, while the other group was not given any reviews. the professor found that the students who were made aware of the stereotypes by outside parties were more likely to be critical of them when reviewing the film themselves, while the unexposed students rarely perceived the stereotypes.

in the end (IMO), i don’t think Lucas consciously injected stereotypes into TPM, or any of the other films for that matter. in an effort to make the Star Wars galaxy seem as diverse (if not more) than our own world, he obviously (and subconsciously) created characters that possess seemingly earthbound racial traits. however, i think it is wrong to label him as some type of bigot based on the Star Wars films.

#65

Make a thread in the Star Wars board. :slight_smile:

We touched on this subject a little bit in the Jedi Arrogance thread. missmuphett pointed out that it was love that that ultimately made Luke break the cycle, which is ironic because the denial of love and the fear of losing another loved one is what turned Anakin. I agree with her 100%. Luke had to find his own path as a Jedi. He didn’t have a bunch of Jedi in his face telling him to shut from his feelings. Unlike Anakin, Luke is constantly surrounded by people who cared about him and supported him unconditionally. It’s not that the Jedi didn’t care about Anakin it’s just they didn’t believe in expressing emotion due to fear of the darkside. Luke had Owen and Beru as parents well into young adulthood and then caring friends in Han and Leia etc. It’s these supportive people that allowed Luke to be who he was that made the difference when it came to redeeming his father.

#66

Grace Park! So fine! I want to touch the hiney.

I’ll be in my bunk.

#67

Yep, he narrated some Thomas related things too. A season or two and a movie or something.

Oddly enough, I was reading an interview with Grace Park where she addressed the model vs. actress idea at Complex:

#68

Dear Ms. Park,

I was overjoyed to hear you call into the GWC podcast. You are such a talented actress–BSG wouldn’t be the same without you. I apologize that some have made fun of you for not knowing how many there are in the GWC crew. But not to worry. As it turns out, you were correct. There are four—Chuck, Sean, Audra and one other person: Click here: http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/showpost.php?p=39544&postcount=21

Love always,
Bunktime (Thotfullguy)

#69

I love you, Grace

#70

You are good TFG, or um I mean the other guy is good.

#71

r u talkin about me? I did an anders one for the girls in the ‘glowing spine thread’ too.

#72

… I just jumped into the thread, and I’m only halfway thru the cast, so I may have missed previous discussion of this, but… it’s understandable that the droids wouldn’t recognize the characters later. Because their memory has been wiped.

Here’s the problem: What about Obi-Wan? Was HIS memory wiped? I know he’s older and he’s lost a step, but at no point does he recognize R2D2 and CP30?

Good discussion of Darth Maul, who rules… Do any of the supplemental EU materials make it clear what race he belongs to? And if the planet looks like that, don’t they have toothbrushes?

Really enjoying installment one of this arc.

Also, here’s my big beef with Episode I, which the GWC crew briefly touched on:

Count of characterization hints that Anakin could become evil: Zero

Count of poop/fart jokes: 3. And lame ones, at that.

“You-sa in deep doodoo, arrogant Jedis!”

#73

I haven’t listened past the grace park call, but to add to your list, my major problem was the tremendous step backwards in technology between ep 3 and 4. They should have made the ships in 1-3 look klunkier, not more futuristic than 4-6. :frowning:

#74

Very good point. A friend who’s into military stuff made the same point, and went on to say that it’s unlikely that the military would have so much turnover of various models and units in so little time.

Grace Park call is, like, best call ever.

As always, I defer to Kevin Smith when it comes to Star Wars commentary – skip to 4:30 in the clip:

//youtu.be/v/Dxe9mDpkx9A&hl=en

#75

Thanks for the accolades, Phil. Getting into the reasoning on why Luke was the one to break the cycle is a bit complicated, in my opinion, because it is enveloped by the overall decline of the Jedi, and their failures as an Order. The Jedi were originally formed by Force Sensitives to investigate the true nature of the Force, both light and dark, a kind of think-tank for spiritual enlightenment. But as the Galaxy and the Force evolved, the Order became stagnant and unbending. Dogma, though well intentioned, became the Jedi’s eventual downfall, as they stymied any originality, any ambition, as potential agents of corrupting temptation. Palpatine was at least somewhat truthful (as the greatest deceptions have the hint of real truth) when he said that from the Sith standpoint, the Jedi had become corrupted. At the twilight of the Republic, the Jedi were truly in their decline, and rife for the Sith to sucker punch to death.

Luke was the product of two great Jedi Masters who lived to see the error in their Order’s ways, who had made the greatest fundamental mistakes in judgment and training that cost the Galaxy so much destruction and bloodshed. Obi-Wan and Yoda listened to the Force again (off-handedly alluded in Episode III, when Yoda said he was communing with Qui-Gon beyond the grave), and gave Luke very little dogmatic training, trusting his own power and his own feelings to chart the right course for himself. And even then they screwed him up by lying to him about Vader and his father. But Luke, who by their plan was supposed to destroy Vader, overcame their continued errors in judgment and allowed his love to redeem his father, which in turn allowed Vader to overcome his fear and obedience to the Emperor. He threw down his weapon, he symbolically sacrificed himself to save his father, which cleansed the guilt and misery and corruption from Vader to allow the good man that was Anakin Skywalker to break free and destroy his Master (not something either Yoda or Obi-Wan foresaw or believed could happen). Luke’s own insight and faith (in himself, in his father, in the Force) won out, where the Jedi way had failed. Hence, the New Jedi Order, through which Luke was able to correct many of the stagnant ways that the prior Order had fallen prey to.

#76

Please: never say the words, “Jar-jar got lucky” again. There isn’t enough brain-bleach in the world.

#77

I thought of the droids only C3PO had his mind wiped, I believe in Revenge of the Sith Bail Organa said “oh, and have the protocol droid’s mind wiped” when he was giving the droids to Captain Antilles. I don’t think R2D2 needed to… which might explain why he’s a bit more there than C3PO most of the time :stuck_out_tongue:

But you make a good point about Obi-Wan. What purpose does not knowing who the droids are serve, if it isn’t an error? But I also feel the same way about the whole, oh Darth Vader killed your father blah blah blah. Of course being a fan one tends to look for explanations for that, but still. Disappointingly inconsistent.

#78

I think “TFG” is my initials, but of course you need to bear in mind that I think everything is about me. But she may have meant you TGPAL. I don’t know how you did the glowing spine thing on Ms. Park (I’m referring to her as Ms. Park from now on, because I figure she’s probably ready this right now.), that was wicked cool!

#79

But you didn’t say, ass…?

#80

I think it still fits that Obi-Wan would say that he doesn’t recall ever owning a droid and play dumb about knowing R2 and 3PO. Alec Guiness might not have known the connection and played it straight, but in the overall storyline Obi-Wan did know the droids, but if he were to divulge that to Luke, it opens up all the backstory that he didn’t want Luke to know (although Obi-Wan is my favorite character, I have to admit that he’s kind of an ass [sorry Barb] in his jerking around of Luke). So you see that shifty look between Obi-Wan and R2, like they know a secret they’re not telling anyone else.

PS Here is everyones new assignment. Come up with some new, offensive Star Wars Jokes, so that a new generation of fans can grow up with racial stereotypes assigned to fictional alien creatures. Here’s a starter for you all: Dead Baby Jawa Jokes. Run with that…