James Cameron's Avetar

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#101

Well, I’m surprised Avatar won the golden globe for best Drama picture. Frankly, while I liked it, I’m not sure it really deserves that high of an honor. Amazing popcorn flick, yes. Best film of the year…I don’t know.

Inglorious Basterds was a much better overall film, but I’m not completely outraged about this. This is probably just a ploy to get higher ratings for the Golden Globes, and the Oscars. They have to do this every few years (see Gladiator) in order to suppress their snobby image a bit.

#102

I was encouraging my sister to see Avatar last night. telling her even if the story were lousy, it would be worth it because it’s just so beautiful. she replied that she’d heard the story was complete crap, and I remembered what Audra had said about the couple she’d overheard coming out of the theater. it’s sad how polarizing our political…I hesitate to say discourse…has become. I realize there is virtually no chance my sister will be able to see past what the media she chooses to listen to is telling her the “real” message of the movie is. I almost called her later to tell her not to see it after all. sigh

#103

Star Wars? You mean the same plot as Harry Potter and Star Trek 2009 and every other Hero’s Journey movie?

Lol. “Oh man it’s so derivative” aka “I can’t find anything else to pick on it about so while I liked Dances with Wolves and Last Samurai and Fern Gully and Pocahontas and even though they all have the same basic plot outline Avatar sucks. Those are just homages”

#104

Excellent question Chuck. I don’t have a definite answer but I’m curious what people think.

For me, I find as I consume more media (and perhaps think more critically about it while doing so) I see patterns more often, which can either be really well done and cool, or not very well done and not as cool. In the end our culture is a web of associations and connections, and our ability to make sense of them is what helps us belong (or so I think).

Again, for me, part of making sense of the associations and connections isn’t solely looking at a film and say, hey, this is the same plot as X Y or Z, or look they use the same technique to get from A to Z. There are old stories that can be retold again and again - and oftentimes it’s in the retelling that we see innovation. Taking Avatar as an example, there are really awesome technical innovations, but the same old story is the same old story. And when that same old story is something that plays on (even reifies) hurtful prejudices and historical injustice, well, that’s going to take away from the overall view that someone like me will have of a piece of art or media.

In terms of being “less critical” or “more accepting” of older things, in general I think that nostalgia has a lot to do with it - not only do we see what something is today, but we remember the experiences we had watching it in the past and our own reactions to it in the past. I know that now when I watch, say, Star Wars, I still love the story (romanticize it, even) though at the same time part of my brain is going through and thinking many things that being with “yes, but…”

So - in my experience, nostalgia saves the older stuff, but that doesn’t make it free of the criticism that I might have for the newer stuff. Maybe graduate school does it, but I can’t really turn off my impulse to analyze stories.

That made me laugh, DP :slight_smile: Though I don’t really like any of those other movies, either…

#105

There are VERY FEW original story ideas nowadays.

#106

I saw Avitar and I thought it was good. I was surpirsed that it got the Golden Globe for Best Pichure. I would argue that Inglorious Bastards, and District 9 are b etter, and for me, much more engaging.

My problem with Avatar was not that it was cliche, my problem with Avetor was that I was just not engaged in the characters. You work on a script for 14 years and you can not tell a story a bit differently? You can not make characterzs a bit more interesting? Too much focus on ivishuals and not enough focus on writing keeps this film from being a masterpiece.

With all due respect Chuck, I see where you are coming from. But, for me, there is one clear difference between Avetar and Star Wars, for me, was that Star Wars was much more engaging. For me, in it’s most basic form, Star Wars just did it better. The character s were more interesting. There relationships were better. Star Wars, for me, just did it better.

This is not to say that I did not like Avetar. I enjoyed it. But it had some flaws. For me A few more months on editing, ande rewrites could have really made this a masterpiece.

#107

I have an original story but no one gets it.

…or wants to buy it.

#108

Yeah, I get that a lot too…:frowning:

#109

I agree. It definitely didn’t warrant Best Picture. That’s just nonsense.

#110

What we need is a catagory for “popcorn flick” and another for “story flick.”

They both need to exist, so why pit them against each other?

#111

There aren’t enough “story flicks” being made anymore to fill a category.

#112

There’s already an award for “best popcorn movie”. It’s called “box office takings”.

To be honest, I don’t think Avatar was the best popcorn movie of the year either. for me, that was Star Trek, hands down (but it would never win a golden globe because it’s based on a TV show, and they tend to look down on TV-to-movies).

#113

Flick vs Film

Been talkin about it for years

#114

I feel i should point out that when i saw Camerons reaction to winning best Pic at the Globes he too seemed surprised. I really expected Hurt Locker or Baterds to win. The way I have been describing it is that Avetar is not the best movie of the year but it is the most amazing movie of the year. And I can see why Cameron could win best director. It was his vision that brought everything together but overall I Avetar did not even make it into my top 5 movies of the year and probably just scrapped by into the top 10.

#115

I like that. I may steal it.

#116

“Avatar banned in China”
http://uk.movies.yahoo.com/blog/article/11190/avatar-banned-in-china.html

The China Film Group, which is run by the state, believes the plot of human colonists attempting to demolish an alien village for its resources steers too close to a very sensitive issue in China at the moment.

Millions of Chinese people have been evicted from their homes to make room for high rises and government infrastructure projects, reports The LA Times. Avatar’s success has also angered some Chinese officials, who fear the film’s popularity takes too much market share from their domestic films.

I’m surprised China allowed the film to be shown in the first place.

#117

There was some noise made because it trumped pretty much all their domestic releases put together (China allows a very limited number of foreign films to be shown.) One of their papers ran an editorial about how it “shamed” their directors (or words to that effect.)

#118

Bound to happen eventually.

http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/01/19/man-dies-after-watching-avatar/
“Man Dies After Watching Avatar
A 42-year-old Taiwanese man died of a stroke, which his doctor claims was likely triggered by “over-excitement” from watching James Cameron’s Avatar in 3D. According to News.com.au, the man began to feel sick during a screening earlier this month and was taken to hospital.”

Edit: Anyone watch Cameron on Leno last night? Leno asked him about his movie being anti-military and he said his son and his son’s friends served in Desert Storm. He added that Jake was a marine and was a tribute to them.

#119

Finally saw it and have to say it was quite amazing. The 3D really was spectacular. I was struck by Chuck’s comparison to the early Star Wars films. The comparison answered the question whether my less than complete satisfaction with the SW prequels was the result of less than stellar movie making or if it was just the difference between viewing them when you’re 6 versus watching them for the first time as an adult. Avatar tells me it is more the result of the former because of how enjoyable it was and how similar it is in many ways to the earlier movies. It has near revolutionary and mind-blowing effects that creates a new world in extraordinary detail enabling anyone of any age could get lost in for 2.5 hours. The story is derivative (not meant to be a slight as most movies are derivative be they scifi or period pieces and historical bio pics that tend to be Oscar bait) incorporating a strong and not too subtle message much. Unlike the Prequels I suspect this will be much more re-watchable for me. However, because I’ve had much more experience watching movies than I did when I first saw ANH, I suspect it won’t profoundly shape the way I view movies in the same way the Prequels did.

Has there been much discussion of the music here? We had a preview of a Celine Dion concert movie which was kind of annoying because the chord progression in the main Avatar theme was extremely similar to her Titanic song. Hearing that kept bringing me out of the movie.

I also have to agree that those who argue that this movie depicts the military in a negative light really did miss the point. Sully clearly represented a Marine mentality (symbolized as him is always wearing an old marine t-shirt and never the mercenary uniform). It is also not a coincidence that he held on to the principles of honor and remained an outsider to the mercenary forces. I guess the folks at Blackwater (or Xe or what ever they are going by these days) may think they were viewed negatively, but I don’t see how it could be argued that the actual armed forces were.

All in a really enjoyable flick.

#120

Re: Music

Very much did not like the end-credit music. I understand that symphony stuff is almost the required music for Science Fiction movies, and I liked the fact that Avatar chose NOT to fall into this rut, but… it’s like the opening theme to Enterprise. It seemed discordant. Is that just me?