Ah, the shadow babies. Those things are all kinds of creepy but then so is Melisandre. I get the creeps just reading about her since I think she’s doing something bad to Stannis to make those shadow babies.
I am very interested to start seeing some casting for season 2. Melisandre and Stannis need to be properly cast. However I’m really holding out for Brienne and the rest of the Tully’s
For now, I think so too. She definitely doing something to Stannis, if it’s his shadow that’s being birthed and doing all these things and most importantly, without his conscious knowledge. But other than how graphic Martin’s description of that whole scene was (he really has a way of making me feel like I’m right there besides Davos, witnessing this horrific skin crawling thing) - it also caught me completely off guard. I knew something sinister was going to happen once Stannis asked Davos to boat mysterious Melisandre over, but THAT was pretty much the last thing I expected. The only other scene so far in the book that surprised me that much was Renly’s sudden throat slit - I had to read the paragraph again because I was like, wait, what now? Did that just happen? No, it can’t be…holy crap, it did.
Me too! Maybe it’s because I watched half the first season before reading book 1, so I had faces and voices from the show in my head as I read along. But reading book 2, I would think about who’d play the new characters.
I’m also looking forward to see who plays Asha, who I love already just from how we’re introduced to the character, LMAO. (And now I see why they had that scene with Theon talking to and being gross to Osha on the tv show, since he even makes the comparison of Osha/Asha while he fumes about being played. Nice touch.)
Weirdly, I totally picture Michael Hogan as Stannis. I realize Stannis isn’t that old - especially since the show seemed to have changed Stannis into the younger brother of Robert - but for me, I can hear his voice saying all of Stannis’ dialogue, and I do imagine Stannis to be the type of person who looks way older than his age because he’s so devoid of joy his entire life.
And Davos…Mark Sheppard, maybe? No matter, it’s only a matter of time before he’d be in the show anyway. 
Brienne, I don’t think at this point in the book, I have a full grasp of her character to think about who would play her. I kind of just imagine someone who obviously is smart (since she’s a damn good fighter) and experienced, but at the same time is pretty innocent and naive given how devoted she was to Renly, of all people.
I’ve been waiting for the casting of Asha because she’s one of my favorite characters. I haven’t thought who I would pick for her but it has to be someone who can convincingly pull off the Theon reunion scene.
I never thought of Michael Hogan for Stannis but I think that would be awesome casting, Stannis is one of the more important characters and I know he could pull it off.
Mark Sheppard would be good for Davos. As for Brienne I want someone who is a good actress, maybe someone with the acting chops of Lily Loveless but with the way Brienne is described she’s really hard to pick an actress to play her.
He’s the middle Baratheon brother in the books, too. It’s easy to forget because he’s so dour.
He is? Oh, whoops. I thought part of the reason why he’s so dour is because he is the eldest, and that’s why he’s never taken to Robert and despised Renly for getting Storm’s End while Robert relegated him to rule the islands instead (can’t remember name right now). See, this is what happens when I’m reading too quickly.
<—slow reader
Appendix time!
Dragonstone is the island. Stannis definitely seems like the oldest brother. I tend to picture him Sean Connery-esque (around the time of The Rock) but he’s not that old.
Anyone else catch the change in the Targaryan family tree in the last episode of the TV show. They removed a King, Jaehaerys II, and made Egg Aerys’ father.
What? When was that?
Aemon was listing his various relative. “My father was Maekar, first of his name. My brother Aegon reigned after him when I refused the throne. And he was followed by his son Aerys who they called the Mad King”. While in the books Aegon’s son was Jaehaerys II who was the father of Aerys. It’s probably not that big a deal, he was only king for 3 years. It must be to make Aemon a little younger and to not confuse people. I consider myself quite well informed regarding the Targaryan family tree and I get them confused a bit as their names are very similar.
One question it brings to mind is where does Rhaella fit into this, she was Jaehaerys’ sister and married into the Baratheons. This link gave Robert some legitimacy. It might not come up at all. But if she’s still Egg’s daughter then she is Aerys’ sister in the show, which makes the relationship between the Targaryans and the Baratheons quite a bit closer.
Well, most of the time we spend on him he IS the eldest (surviving.)
Huh. That is interesting.
Oh, yes, I thought that was a little odd when it happened. I assume maybe it was a time constraint thing, so they ‘shortened’ the family tree so Aemon’s speech wouldn’t be as long.
Anyway, more book 2 WTFs:
I was completely taken aback while reading about Catelyn and Tyrion all receiving word that Bran and Rickon was killed by Theon. WHAT? WHEN DID THAT HAPPEN? There’s no way I could have missed that. So I went back to the previous Theon chapter to doublecheck, and it confirmed how I felt: I wasn’t worried for the children and thought they (plus their direwolves and Osha) will no doubt outsmart Theon since they’d been doing that through that entire earlier chapter. So, I thought, nah, this is just Theon sending false messages out to the realm because he’s butthurt that he was outwitted by children. It’s ok, it’s just a trick. Bran and Rickon will be fine.
Then of course, I get to the next Theon chapter, and we get “concrete” proof of the boys’ death with their bodies being flayed and and paraded at the walls of the castle (which overthrew my previous theory) and I was utterly devastated (and also completely pissed that the book didn’t even show us what exactly happened, that it all happened ‘off-book’). So I read the chapter thinking, darnsit, Martin, you are a sadist, and of course you’re going to kill those boys right at the moment where I was completely comfortable that they weren’t going to die. I hate you.
Of course once I got to the end of that chapter…darn it, Martin, you sly little minx. It WAS a trick all along after all. You got me.
deep breath My emotions are getting such a workout reading this book.
ETA other random book 2 stuff:
Sansa. Huh. She is a tough one to like, huh? I’m actually a bit more forgiving of her than most (it seems), but she is one frustrating character who I only like when she has chats with The Hound (the only person who gives her nothing but brutal honesty, which she sorely needs to snap her out of her ‘save me knight’ illusions). But anyway, I’m a little ashamed that I thought her understandable reaction (hey, no one wants to bed Joffrey) to her menstruation (Burn the sheets! No, the bed too! BURN EVERYTHING!) was kind of hilarious, and made me chuckle even though it’s obviously quite a traumatizing thing that happened to her.
There hasn’t been a lot of Jaime in the book (so far), but I can’t wait to watch his conversation with Catelyn on the show. (Maybe it’ll be cut, but somehow I doubt that. It’s one of those scenes.) That whole bit about knights’ honor and how conflicted all of their vows are was great.
I just finished my re-read of the first four books and all I can say is it July 12th yet? I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve read the first 3 books but this is only the second time I’ve finished the 4th book. I had forgotten all the new questions it brought up.
Am I the only one who thinks the Princess of Dorne was secretly betrothed to Viserys? Or who wants to kill Littlefinger for using Sansa as his pawn and hates that she’s still not smart enough to figure it out?
I’m really looking forward to reading Dany’s chapters in the next book because she’s got quite the interesting collection of people either headed to her or on the continent with her already that she could put to some interesting uses. Imagine what she could do with Quentyn Martell, Victarion Greyjoy, Marwyn the Mage, whatever Maester Oldtown deems fit to get rid of the blood of the dragon, Tyrion and Arya. Of course it was probably the fact that a lot of action is now centering around Dany that took the book so long to be written.
Didn’t Doran Martell state this is exactly what was planned. He knew that the other suitors he set up for Arrianne were going to be unacceptable to her.
Watch out for the Golden Company. I’m almost certain they’re going to get involved. It’s possible that a Targ decendant still runs it and I would wager that they have Blackfyre in their possession. I wonder if they’ll be for Dany or against her, it really could go either way. But Blackfyre would make a good symbol for a legitmate Targ monarch.
He doesn’t outright state that it was Viserys, only that it had to be a secret, that he was dead now and shows her a little dragon. I assumed that meant Viserys but it wasn’t explicitly stated as such. I’d say it’s most likely that it was Viserys and might even have brokered by Illyrio, which means Varys likely knew of it too.
I think many of those that have set out to join Dany will not find her to be the pushover they seem to be expecting, the Golden Company should watch it because I don’t think Dany will let anything get in her way when it comes to the throne. I don’t think Blackfyre would be a big threat to Dany because she has the dragons and he does not. The only ones I can see as a threat are if Rhaegar’s son is actually alive or if Jon is the legitimate child of Rhaegar and Lyanna. But I don’t think they will be much of a threat when Dany arrives in Westeros with 3 dragons and an army of Unsullied. I think Dany will simply take the Throne and let her dragons eat Blackfyre and anyone else who tries to manipulate her. She’s not Sansa and easy to turn into a pawn, she’s far better at playing the game than most of those still vying for power in Westeros. If Jon is her nephew she’ll make him her Heir so she doesn’t have to have a child to secure the Throne. She’s also pretty obviously the Queen in Cersei’s prophecy, not Margaery.
I see, I thought Doran made it clear. I guess not. It’s been a while since I’ve read AFfC. But yeah, he was almost certainly talking about Viserys
I should have been more clear. I was refering to Blackfyre, the sword of Aegon the Conquerer. Which is probably in possession of The Golden Company after Bittersteel took it after Daemon Blackfyres death. There’s a bit in The Mystery Knight, that I won’t go into too much detail about that suggests to me that possession of Blackfyre (the sword) would go along away to suggest legitimacy of a Targ king (or queen). Hell the possession of it kicked off a series of rebellions. It can be confusing, we have several people, several rebellions and a sword all called Blackfyre.
Well, I think he made it clear but since he never outright says it was Viserys you know someone will claim it was someone else. There are some pretty wacky theories out there, especially regarding who may or may not be Targaryens or which Targaryens might still be alive.
I was confused about the Blackfyre bit since I couldn’t remember there being a Targ bastard still alive but it’s hard to keep track with all the bloody theories out there about who is a Targ. Leave it to a Targaryen to name a sword with the same name given to their bastards.
I think Daemon took his name from the sword, after it was given to him by Aegon IV (I think it was Aegon IV, the unworthy, it’s hard to keep track off). It’s all very complicated. Many Targ bastards seem to take their own name: Bittersteel, Bloodraven, Seastar.
(shielding my eyes)
I got done with book 2 last night. The last batch of chapters … were actually a bit less climactic than I was expecting, and also not as surprising compared with how I felt earlier re: shadow babies and re: Bran and Rickon’s “death”. Though I’m liking the turn of events in Jon’s SL. (That, I didn’t expect, Jon ‘joining’ the wildlings.)
But I am so very curious as to how they’ll depict the blackwater bay massacre on the show now. Holy crap, that’s one huge battle scene that they’ll have no way around - it must be shown, and it must be great.
Coco (might I congratulate you on your FSL entry, I just laughed myself sick), ACoK was honestly my least favorite of the books. There were some good points to it, but other than the Battle of the Blackwater and the bits with Theon, I thought the least amount of stuff happened in it and it’s the one I look forward to reading the least in my yearly rereads.
I know some people like the fourth book least, but I honestly like it more than the second! Spoilery reasons why follow, and though this is the spoiler thread I’ll put it under a tag in case coco comes back: [spoiler]Even if it was effectively split in half, between Jaime’s POV, Cersei’s POV, Brienne’s POV, “Cat” and “Alayne”'s POV’s, Sam’s POV, and “Fire and blood,” AND all the serious hinting at background that I only really noticed this readthrough, it’s pretty good! Arianne, Victarion, and Damphair’s chapters were really the only ones that brought me down.[/spoiler]
I think you are right about the fourth book. It’s my least favourite, mainly for the reasons you say. There’s a lot of good stuff going on, but it seems every other chapter (I exagerate) we’re back on the Iron Islands. The Iron Islands stuff, really drags on and I find it hard to care. Especially when we could have another Arya chapter.
Glad you enjoyed that. Alas, my FSL solution would make no sense to anyone not familiar with the show and how rampant sexpositioning is on it. (Hm, maybe all that talk of nekkid ladies and dongs will encourage more people to watch it? I’m a little surprised not more people are watching it here , because for me, this show is sort of up there along with BSG as a genre show that’s also really just an excellent, excellent drama with a deep bench of great characters who are never just strictly heroic or evil. I had the same ‘it hooked me right in’ feeling watching the first few eps as I did with BSG.)
Aw, thanks for the spoiler tag. I’m pretty good at sideeying all the spoilers, as long as people state it (like, hey, talking about book _ now, go.) at the beginning of their posts. Usually if I catch a peek of any names I’m not familiar with, I immediately go to the next post.
But anyway. I haven’t read the next 2 books yet (obviously that will soon change…), but I think I do like GoT just a bit more than ACoK. In terms of the book as a whole, I think a lot of things do happen - and I love a lot of those parts. Again, SHADOWBABIES. How will they film that? - but they aren’t clearly plotted out in character arcs as GoT had (like with Dany’s arc, or Ned’s, or Jon’s, or Robb’s, etc, etc), and doesn’t feel as conclusive as GoT did by the end of it. ACoK starts off with a fustercluck of kings and chaos and big intros to new places and characters, but simmers down considerably before the blackwater fustercluck (and the Bran/Rickon switcheroo, I guess, is probably the other big WTF reveal, maybe?). Characters are even more detached from each other and mostly their individual arcs seem to be more of a continuation of their respective journeys with less defined growth and them arriving at some kind of a point B. (In fact, most of the characters either get killed off, or are still deep in the middle of their journey from point A to B. There’s less resolution by the end of the book, besides the deaths. But, yeah, Theon’s arc will be hilarious to watch, that’s for sure. He’s the one who actually had a distinct point A to point B (to point C and D…) arc out of anyone else with a resolution.)
But I think it’s going to be more interesting to see how the show pulls off book 2 now; the ‘looseness’ of the arcs contained in S2 will give them more leeway to arrange things for the show, and I’m curious what choices they’d make in order to give the season a more well defined arc. I think S2 will show whether these showrunners really know what they’re doing. (S1 obviously did that too, but GoT I feel was probably a little easier to adapt. I can see S2 being even better than the books if they do it right, or a lot worse if they don’t).
I’m still mighty curious why they moved the Cat/Jaime talk (which I was marveling over just days before the finale aired, lol) from S2 up to S1 - because that would mean Jaime will be a nonentity in S2 since that was the one big Jaime scene of book 2- which could very well be the case, maybe NikolajCW is off S2 and can come back again in S3 when presumably Jaime gets back in the swing of things in book 3. Presumably…?)
Yeesh, long post.