Jive-talking twin Transformers raise race issues. (face palm)
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2009/06/24/entertainment/e034954D88.DTL
Anything to sell newspapers
maybe i’m going all kinds of PC here but they seemed to be on the wrong side of the line of good taste to me. I don’t think they were meant to be racist, but it was a pretty bad stereotyping. to try to get a few laughs.
I’ve seen some plausible defenses of them as being simply young, much like the suburban mall rats who ape that style. The problem is, without some other context it’s really hard to tell.
Not having seen Transformers 2, I’m barely qualified to comment… but after reading this, I’m reminded of the first movie, where they end up killing
[spoiler]Jazz, the one identifiably “black” robot in the movie – another typical thing that seems to happen with black characters in action/horror films[/spoiler]
I can see how some people would be upset… Bay’s now established something of a track record with the stereotypes. I doubt he’s setting out to intentionally insult a segment of his paying audience – but it comes across as somebody who’s trying a little too hard… like Vanilla Ice.
Hmmm… I really didn’t see them that way (same goes for Jar Jar) but the article certainly makes some valid points. I think it really boils down to your own position when you view the film. For me, as a woman, I was put off by all the constant Megan Fox slow-mo running scenes. At the very lease Josh Duhmel could have had his shirt ripped off by an explosion, just to balance things out.
We always say how America is a big melting pot, but when anyone depicts any ethnicity, they get accused of racism. It’s a no-win.
I’m with Pike and the others on this - it was somewhat offensive, mainly because there was no context or explanation to show why they sounded and acted like exaggerated “black” stereotypes. We do know there is a history in American culture to mis-use those stereotypes and show “black” characters, whether real or implied, as inferior.
I don’t think there’s a problem when “any ethnicity” (beyond white, I’m assuming) is depicted. It’s how they’re depicted - if all the heroes and leaders are (or seem to be) one ethnicity, and all the fools, jesters, illiterates, and squabbling juveniles appear to be another ethnicity, it makes things uncomfortable since it seems to be sending a message about what each group is “like.”
For what it’s worth, I don’t think Michael Bay or the voice actors used “black” stereotypes to consciously denigrate anyone. I think they just thought it was funny, as did a lot of people who saw the movie. As someone who’s taught and worked in African-American studies classes, this type of thing would be a prime example of modern stereotyping. But, in the mainstream world, I guess I don’t feel that expending the energy criticizing that aspect is worth much, since the movie is vaguely offensive in so many ways. Using “black” stereotypes is offensive, but I don’t think it’s the dominating problem this movie poses.
Now, I personally agree that the characters weren’t very amusing and pushed the limit of Star Wars prequel-esque racial stereotyping. That said, I want to momentarily play devil’s advocate and respond to the frequent comment that there was no context or justification for the twins’ speech and mannerisms.
In the first movie, Optimus specifically states that in the Autobots “learned of Earth’s languages from the World Wide Web.” As a matter of fact, this line of dialogue came directly in response to Sam asking why Jazz talked the way he did. It’s still relatively low brow comic relief (especially in the twins’ case), but it does go some way in the way of justification.
I don’t know.
They sounded like Mater.
Saw the movie. The GF (black) thinks they make Jar-Jar look good. I (white) didn’t think they were that bad, but they definitely felt ‘wrong.’ The gold-toothed one was the worst, particularly since that’s such an identifiable ‘black’ thing (very few whites do that) but also because his voice reminded me of a black actor doing a ‘gay’ voice. (The GF thinks I’m reading too much into it at that point.)
I never noticed the gold tooth, but I didn’t care for their foul mouths. I was a bit surprised at the level of cussing in this film, knowing how many under 10 year old kids would be there. So that bothered me more.
I still think it’s a no-win. Do I come off as oblivious to racial stereotypes because I didn’t see the twins as such? Pike, are you really overreacting? Can we place all this in the same realm as sexual stereotypes? Not necessarily wanting to go there, but again, I think it boils down to your own personal perspective and experiences. I love that we can discuss these things here in an intelligent way.
You know I am not sensitive to PC issues at all. I guess being of the race and creed that doesn’t get opressed I am not offended by ANYTHING. I did laugh at the twins, however NONE of the Black people in my audience either time lauged after a few jokes and it became apparent to them that these were "goofy black youth " sterotypes.
When it got to the part where the twins admit that they can’t read. You could have heard a pin drop in the row in front of me where the black guy was there with his two sons.
I got to thinking about all of those sensitiive people that get tore up because Uhura kissed Spock, or Megan Fox was a prize and I wondeered how they feel about the twins who:
-
Are obviously “black” chararacters ( anyone who says otherwise is just TRYING to pretend )
-
They are overly silly, loud, and have poor grammer.
-
the one has “bug eyes” comonly associated with black dudes that have been smoking weed. If you look closely their faces are charactures that resemble black kids
-
Gold tooth and the one has mechanical dreds
-
Every word out of their mouth was something stupid
-
and the worst one… these were robots that couldn’t read…by their own choice. ( an intersting note- I had to take my little sister’s kid to see the movie for my second time. I watched the audiace during the twin parts.) the entire white audiace laughed and looked around at the black people to see if they were laughing too. Most weren’t. when they saw that… they did the “guilty chuckle” then fell silent. If that doesn’t tell you anything about weather the jokes fell a little racist, i don’t know what does.
I am not normaly on the side of the offended, I ususally feel that “the offended” are trying to be offended and that they should lighten up a little… but I wouln’t want to take my kid to see a “family” movie and have a robot that was clearly from tennesee being depicted as haveing sex with his relatives and not knowing how to read! ( despite the fact that they are robots and have to have programing…and that idea is stupid). So I wasn’t offended… but I wouldn’t argue for one second against anyone who actualy was black and thought that this was racist humor.
Wow. If Roosterpfunk is offended…
QED
I agree with your GF on the worse than Jar-Jar. They were very stereotyped and I found them totally annoying. When one of them got sucked into Devastator…I cheered and laughed…and then said Craaaap when he punched his way out of his head. And I thought one of the voices had a wee bit of a “gay” sound to it.
And their faces/heads reminded me of Gremlins…it was the “ears”…somebody broke the no feeding rule.
Yeah I better do something really offesive soon or I loose my street cred!
an awesome movie idea just came to mind Gizmo and prime vs spike and star scream in next summers most explosive movie since lesbian vampire hunters,
Gremlins vs transformers,
god help us all; if it rains.
I had seen this thread before I went to see the movie. I refrained from reading the article fully because I didn’t want to spoil anything. But I was aware of the issues somewhat and I was looking for them. I did not find them funny, in the least, seperate from the racial stereotypes. I found the stereotypes portrayed, old, tired & not funny in the least. This was not Friday with an obvious send up of African American culture, this was a movie aimed at kids, all kids. Cementing stereotypes in a kids movie like this is frankly obnoxious & borderline reckless.
I whole heartedly support this idea!
I have to say I agree.
There are many fans that have been trying to make excuses for these two movies because they are “for kids”. Humping dogs, humping robots, pot brownies, Slut Robots and racial sterotypes don’t belong. If it’s a move FOR ADULTS… I can overlook al this.
as a children’s or even teen movie… I think it’s a liitle uncalled for… and even worse, not really funny.
Like she said, this isn’t Friday.
And apparently “for kids” means “dragging all the eight-year-olds in the neighborhood to a PG-13 movie” (and then sitting right behind me just as the movies starts.)
Although, this was the first movie where idle kicks to my seat and the reverent recital of every swear word used didn’t really detract from the experience.
my little brother likes to tell the parents of the big groups of kids, when they sit behind him in a movie… " Hey, I have to tell you this legaly since your 10 feet or less from me… I am a convicted sex offender, just letting you know, cause I have to… you know… cause it’s the law."
They move away every time!
I keep telling him it’s gonna get him in a fight one day… but he feels it is worthwhile to keep his AOR kid free.