I didn’t get that at all. I got two extremely distressed people comforting each other as best they can.
I have to go with Adama too, but I can still understand Zarek’s problems with leadership in the fleet.
Me neither… but what complicates matters is that Adama’s trusted subordinates were terrorists… just on our side.
Watching last night, I can totally see why Richard Hatch had to convince himself that Cain’s leadership was good. That was the type of leadership that he and Gaeta were essentially putting into place together. It was brutal, forced, ugly. I can’t wait to see Gaeta get his comeuppance. I think Zarek is no one unless he has followers doing his dirty work for him. Scare away the followers, he’s not a man of action on his own.
Obviously, despite their flawed ways, and I do acknowledge them, I am for Roslin and Adama’s leadership. There was room for improvement, but I didn’t feel they were so vile.
I think you nailed when you said:
Vile is the word I’ve been searching for.
I just recently listened to the Richard Hatch podcast. Frankly I cannot get my head around Zarek as the revolutionary which to me implies a person of principle, one that is righteous. I do not see Zarek as the freedom fighter with Adama as the oppressor. The reasons have already been explored so I won’t bother to go there.
I can get behind Thomas Jefferson, I can even get behind Trotsky, Guevara, Berdyaev, etc but Zarek, no way does Zarek fall into that category.
I’m siding with Adama, cause here is how i see it:
- As a couple of people have on this thread have pointed out, there has been a real government since the bombs went off.
- Adama and Roslin have led us this far and we’re still alive, we’ll argue freedom and values once the survival thing has been dealt with and nailed down.
- Tigh, Anders, and Chief are cylons, but they lead the rebellion on New Craprica, also Athena. So as much as i’d still hate the Cylons for destroying humanity, if the rebel cylons really wanted to finish us off, they would have done it by now and they’ve had many oppertunities to do so.
- The Cavil cylons and other forces are still out there, so we’re all in the same boat. So yeah, upgrade the FTL drives.
First, I am siding with Adama, this mutiny is just wrong. There are so many things wrong about it, it’s hard to know where to start. I also think Keara hit the nail on the head. Adama/Roslin were not great, there is/was room for improvement. But, it wasn’t the vile thing Zarek makes it out to be.
I just want to briefly touch on Zarek. First, I think Richard Hatch thorughly enjoys this role, as well he should. This man is a complicated man, who manipulates to get to his ideal. They label him as a terrorist, given that he bombed a building, it’s probably appropriate, but I do have to point out, we don’t know the context in which it was done. Freedom fighter? He certainly thinks he is, but in the end he’s a ruthless bully who resorts to violence when he doesn’t get his own way. Granted, Adama & Roslin completely dismissing him pushed him, but extremes like this are dicey at best, & he knows that.
I tend to be more sympathetic to the Roslin and Adama leadership duo. The one real act I can’t abide with is Laura’s attempt to steal the election. I do admit that they can get stubborn at times, and need events to come a little to close to a head before doing the right thing (i.e., the tylium ship strike). However, I do feel that their time in charge may be passing and the fleet could use new leadership. I agree with the first posts of the thread (and with a point I made maybe over a year ago) that it is time for Lee to be President and Helo to be Commander of the fleet…
well if that doesnt say it all:)
who doesnt?? but in this case democracy isnt gona work until they find a suitable planet. so its always pick the lesser of 2 evils
I’d vote for that ticket… maybe that’s what the mutiny will come down to: Gaeta/Zarek and Adama/Roslin at odds, tearing the fleet apart, until they both agree to a change of leadership.
I think lamenting the death of Democracy while the fleet is under way is premature. Democracy is a wondefully messy thing. At sea and by extension in space there is not room for Democracy when the margins seperating life and death are so very thin. This is why the masters of ships are vested with so much authority, and life at sea is basically life in a dictatorship. Hopefully your captain is a benevolent dictator or its a long, long voyage. This of course gets even more comlicated because BSG is in a wartime setting and the fleet is carrying all of humanity. Democracy will flourish again once it has some soil to put roots into. Until then stick with Adama he always finds a way to win.
Democracy, of course, has taken a hit now that the Quorum is gone, but they were almost always portrayed as ineffectual and easily led. So you could argue that they had very little part in the democracy and were in fact just figureheads to keep the people satisfied they had representation. We didn’t often see the Quorum making decisions that had any real impact. (But I missed a few epis here and there so I could be mistaken.)
I assume the next thing to do is hold elections for a new Quorum - would that, in itself, be a reminder of the benefits of democracy, and a bit of a necessary distraction for people in need of something else to do now that Erf proved to be such a bust?
If we revisit politics in the BSG universe I hope someone will point out that the idea of having representation based on which charred irradiated rock you used to call home is laughable. If any form of representative democracy was going to take place in the fleet I imagine it would be based on which ship one resided on. Think “The chair now reckognizes the representative from the spinny ship for five minutes.” But this would have to be interim as it wouldn’t make much sense once the fleet found a home.
Yeah, I’ve said all along that that old form of government is a sham. Either have some sort of war emergency government (my pick) or like you said, a government that represents the way things are now, not the way things used to be. They should put a big picture of their old constitution on the walls in the memorial hallway and start new.
Actually I’m with you and the emergency powers. Let each captain run his ship according to maritime/spacefaring law and let the admiral lead the fleet. Find a home first, start a government second.
I totally agree. And I think Helo, above all other characters demonstrates the most integrity. There’s quality.
Well said. I agree.
I agree completely.
I have to say, I’m pretty much in agreement.
Nicely said. I agree.
If ther must be some representive government, I am in favor of a Tyrol/Helo Administration. Both characters have spoken truth to power and do not have any reservations about telling Adama or anyone else to frak off.