Okay, so Jack set us up the bomb and Juliet blew it up. Since we have eight months to kill, who wants to take a stab at guessing what happens next?
Uh…I am completely flummoxed. Loved the episode. I keep seeing that scene where faux-Locke kicks Jacob into the fire. Brutal.
I see what I think are two possibly divine or god-like beings in a struggle for power–Jacob and bearded dude. Except there was not really a struggle on Jacob s end, only on bearded dude s end. (Forgive me for the lack of apostrophes. Every time I hit one my keyboard sends me into quick find for the page and I have not been able to fix that. I think I need to reinstall, as the arrow and insert keys are no longer working either. I digress) For me the Jacob storyline surpassed the other one, even though both were really gripping. Seeing Juliet sucked into that hole was brutal and then at the bottom of it…ugh. FWIW, I think that bearded dude is the “Jacob” that Ben has been serving these many years. I think he has been the one living in the cabin. (I believe he is the profile we saw in the one screen cap when Ben and Locke visited the cabin.) While Jacob is benevolent, bearded dude is angry and mean, so what happened in the cabin that night would seem to come from him. I think that Ilana and her crew knew the cabin was inhabited by bearded dude and that they were looking specifically for him when they approached it, initially.
OK, those are my thoughts about last night s episode for now. I cannot even begin to think about what is coming for the future yet. I may posit some ideas as time passes.
Yeah, I have no idea what may be happening next or even what everything in this episode meant.
I notice that when Jacob was visiting everyone in the past they made a point of showing him touching everyone. Was he “marking” them somehow so they would come to the Island?
Who are Illana and her people? They’re working for Jacob (apparently) but does Ben know who they are? (Note they called Richard “Ricardus”)
OK, Smokey the Monster as Alex told Ben he had to follow faux-Locke or be destroyed. So Smokey is on faux-Locke’s side. Does this mean that Smokey has been opposing Jacob all along?
Still not sure why Illana and company burned the cabin. If Jacob is hanging out at the statue, has it been faux-Locke in the cabin all along? So who has Ben (and Richard) been listening to?
Our time-travelling Losties were all at ground zero of a thermonuclear blast. What did happen there? They can’t have “undone” the first five seasons of the show; the resulting fan riots would level Hollywood. Would flight 815 land in LAX normally but all of them then look at each other and yell “We have to go back!” What about Juliette and Miles in that scenario?
I suspect something completely different has happened but I have no idea what that can possibly be.
Most Lost season enders have left me going 'Whoa!". This one has me going “WTF?”
Good point, I didn’t pick up on that. On that note, the thing I found interesting was that there was only one flashback in the show tonight (Juliet’s) where Jacob wasn’t present at all. I’m guessing this somehow fits with the fact that she came to the island via the others and not via flight 815. Or maybe it’s that the producers thought it was only fair to give Juliet one more flashback before having her (presumably) die.
That’s right, Jacob did not touch Juliet. Hmmm…
Jacob and the bearded-man/non-Locke add an interesting layer (re: more questions) to the overarching mythology: are they pulling all of the strings, are Widmore’s interests separate, were the Dharma Intiative’s interests separate, etc., etc., etc.
If the bearded-man/non-Locke can possess someone else’s body, can Jacob? I like the theory that bearded-man/non-Locke could be Smokey.
Loved seeing Rose & Bernard. Actually, their scenes were the high point of the episode for me.
It was interesting that Jacob visited some people when they were young (Sawyer, Kate) others when they were older (Jack, Hurly, Sayid).
Oh, and does that mean that Jacob “killed” Nadia? I never believed Ben’s story that Widmore was responsible.
This is definitely a mind frak as far as where the story goes next, who survives and how, and what the implications are.
As long as Sayid, Miles, and Sawyer are alive (oh, and Rose & Bernard), and Kate keeps her paws off of Sawyer, I’ll be good.
I won’t care as long as Vincent survives. I think he’s behind everything anyway.
And I hadn’t thought about Jacob being behind Nadia’s death but you’re right. It looked like he distracted Sayid just long enough for Nadia to get killed. Interesting.
Waves Hi, everyone. I’m new here! I’m a huge LOST fan, so I thought I would give my two cents on last night’s amazing Finale episode!
One thing I think is interesting (that the LOST producers have refused to ever comment on) is that we’ve never actually seen the smoke monster take the form of a (dead) human. We’ve seen it happen before Smokey and after he has appeared, but never the actual transition. So maybe Smokey doesn’t actually take the form of the deceased; maybe it’s a different entity entirely. I, for one believe, that the entity who took the form of Alex (and Christian Shepard) is the same one that is (well, was) pretending to be Locke. I also believe it was the guy from Deadwood at the beginning of the episode, the proverbial Esau (Jacob’s brother in the Bible) as it were.
Frank said something interesting towards the very end of that scene along the lines of “Isn’t this a great way to burn the jungle down?” to which he received no reply. I wonder if they did that on purpose because, for some reason, they’re going to burn down part of the island? Also, I think you’re right, I think that Ben and Richard have been receiving orders from the Anti-Jacob (Esau?). I wonder, however, why Richard would take orders from this other entity, when he obviously knows where Jacob is, what he looks like, and how to get in contact with him.
Did anyone notice that the weaving (tapestry) that Jacob was working on in the beginning of the episode that was hanging on the wall at the end contained both Egyptian-esque hieroglyphs as well as Greek phrases? It’s not very often that the two are combined, and certainly not in LOST.
Something that bugged me through the episode (and it’s very minor, I know) is where is the statue’s other foot? All we see is one foot, and it’s obvious that the other foot must’ve been close by, but we don’t even see another foundation for it. Whatever took the statue out must’ve been big (like maybe the incident or Smokey?), and I hope they show us what happened with it soon.
Whatever the Darleton decides to for the last season of Lost, I have no doubt it’ll be amazing (as long as it’s not Hurley waking up in the mental hospital and it all turned out to be a dream). It’s going to be a long eight months!
I definitely think that Jacob and the bearded guy’s interests are over and above and somewhat unconnected to Widmore’s/Ben’s and the Hostiles/Dharma’s and all the other historical island power struggles. I really need to re-watch that opening scene and review the dialog between Jacob and the bearded man again. I think there are some great clues there. I’m not sure I think Jacob is pulling any strings, as he often emphasizes that people have a choice. Free will seems to be paramount with him. Manipulation, I’m beginning to think, is a main trait of his foil.
If the bearded-man/non-Locke can possess someone else’s body, can Jacob? I like the theory that bearded-man/non-Locke could be Smokey.
This has occurred to me too. I certainly, in reviewing the things that Smokey has done, can see that he seems to be carrying out the intentions/feelings of bearded guy. For instance bearded guy doesn’t like that outsiders come to the island. Notice how Smokey killed the pilot (Greg Grunberg) when Jack, Kate, Charlie found him in the cockpit. Also, it seemed to be a bit Deus ex Machina when the pilot of the Ajira plane got killed with a tree branch through the torso. More thought needs to be put into Smokey’s appearances as Mr. Eko’s brother (and ultimately his judge and executioner), Jack’s dad, Kate’s horse, Hurley’s friend Dave. The appearance as Alex to Ben seems to be an obvious manipulation of Ben to get him to obey faux-Locke. The question remains whether bearded guy = Smokey or if Smokey serves bearded guy. I am fairly certain that Smokey is not neutral and does not serve Jacob. (And WTF has happened to Claire?!)
Loved seeing Rose & Bernard. Actually, their scenes were the high point of the episode for me.
Yes, I agree that seeing them was great. It wasn’t the high point of the episode for me, but frankly, I loved their sentiment: as long as we’re together we’re happy, come what may.
It was interesting that Jacob visited some people when they were young (Sawyer, Kate) others when they were older (Jack, Hurly, Sayid).
Oh, and does that mean that Jacob “killed” Nadia? I never believed Ben’s story that Widmore was responsible.
My interpretation of this was not that Jacob killed Nadia but rather that he saved Sayid. Perhaps Nadia’s death was inevitable but he somehow blessed Sayid, saved him for a special purpose, like the other Losties. It’s hard to know, but my gut tells me that all evidence that we’ve seen of Jacob tells us that he is good. He is benevolent, loving and kind. He is the light to the bearded guy’s dark.
Yes, mind frak is right. I’m left with impressions of the background of the story but no earthly clue where they can go next, except maybe backwards and tell the story of Jacob and bearded guy and show it through the ages and where Richard came in. (I’m thinking he was on the Black Rock.) Another thought I had is that although I think that Ben may have been duped into thinking he was following Jacob all this time, when he was actually following the instructions of the bearded guy, I think Richard may have been the one who duped him. I think Richard may be the “fallen angel.” Perhaps Richard even got his immortality from the bearded man. Or maybe it’s a punishment instead of a gift from Jacob and that’s what led him to follow bearded guy.
I’m completely on board with the Esau relationship. I love the pointed look they share when Ben casually throws out the reference to Moses. (It never occured to me before, but Benjamin was one of Jacob’s sons in the Bible).
I’m wondering if Jacob was trapped inside the cabin by the ring of ash or if it served as a protective barrier to keep Esau (I’ll keep that name as a proxy) out. The broken line may explain why Christian (Esau?) was inhabiting the cabin instead of Jacob.
As mentioned above, I agree that I don’t think those dead people that keep returning are manifestations of Smokey itself, but I think Smokey may be the Gatekeeper to the place where dead people go (Cerberus, etc), and maybe he is allowed to let some of them out on parole from time to time when it serves some purpose.
I’m not sure I’m convinced that the new Loche is just Esau manifesting himself as John… maybe he is still the “ghost” of old Loche on parole. I just don’t see why they (the writers) would have him have to discover that Ben was sworn to him, if he was that powerful. Remember, he also said the Island talked to him… maybe Esau was the voice of The Island in this case directing him, conning him (as Loche is the ultimate mark).
All I can say is the ending made me want to pull my hair out. 
And then they flash the big 2010 up there, and my mind is like “2010!?!!? That’s like the friggin future! I can’t wait that long!” I guess it just feels weird that we’re months away from 2010 and we don’t have flying cars and jet packs yet. I have no clue what next season will be like. But I think smart money is on the nuke having a different effect than the Lostie’s expected.
I kind of felt like the lead up to the Swan station incident was a little long in the tooth. I think the whole submarine mission was a complete waste of time and bloated the story. At least they had the courtesy to blur and disguise the awful CGI submarine this episode. I recognize that these scenes served to progress character development, but the overall progress didn’t quite give me the bang for the buck I would expect for this stage of the game in a season finale.
One hell of a cliff hanger though! Bravo! Now I need to find my ulcer medication if I am going to survive until next season…
Question: Did Ben know, by killing John Locke and getting his body back to the island, that notJohn Locke would appear?
Is the smoke monster, the notAlex, Christian all manifestations of this notJacob entity?
Notice how Jacob had an interaction with Jack (gives him his Apollo bar) at the hospital but never interacts with Christian.
Gah, awesome episode. Did we lose Juliet and/or Sayid? Was her rock-bashing of the H-bomb successful?
And what about Jacob’s “burn” to Ben: “What about you Ben?”
Good point about Jacob & the bearded guy’s interests being above and beyond everything else that is going on. I, too, need to rewatch the beginning.
The question remains whether bearded guy = Smokey or if Smokey serves bearded guy. I am fairly certain that Smokey is not neutral and does not serve Jacob. (And WTF has happened to Claire?!)
Exactly!!! WTF did happen to Claire? And, why did Kate think she could find Claire if she returned to the island (or was that whole conversation to make Claire’s mother feel better)?
My interpretation of this was not that Jacob killed Nadia but rather that he saved Sayid. Perhaps Nadia’s death was inevitable but he somehow blessed Sayid, saved him for a special purpose, like the other Losties. It’s hard to know, but my gut tells me that all evidence that we’ve seen of Jacob tells us that he is good. He is benevolent, loving and kind. He is the light to the bearded guy’s dark.
Ah…okay. That makes sense. Thanks!!
Another thought I had is that although I think that Ben may have been duped into thinking he was following Jacob all this time, when he was actually following the instructions of the bearded guy, I think Richard may have been the one who duped him. I think Richard may be the “fallen angel.” Perhaps Richard even got his immortality from the bearded man. Or maybe it’s a punishment instead of a gift from Jacob and that’s what led him to follow bearded guy.
There is definitely more to Richard than we know. Much more. Maybe Richard was leading Ben astray because he had not truly realized his (Ben’s) role yet. Perhaps that is why Jacob said to Ben, “yes, what about you?”
If we do lose Juliet and Sayid, I think the producers have done the actors and the show a disservice. They are great characters that have much more to offer.
I do think we are going to Lose Juliet & Miles, primarily because we did not see a flashback of Jacob interacting/touching with them. Perhaps those happened, and we’ll get them next season. (crossing fingers, which is difficult while typing)
At first, I thought what Jacob said was a “burn” to Ben, too. Then, after reading some comments about the episode, I read that it could have been a comment to help enlighten Ben. I can read it both ways. Hopefully we’ll see it play out.
As far as Ben goes, Michael Emerson is a great actor. You never truly know when Ben is telling the truth, so we do not really know what Ben does or does not know about the island. Although, I do think that Ben was telling the truth about not having seen Jacob before. (Now that I say that, the opening sequence of the next season will be Ben meeting Jacob, and proving that Ben was in fact lying.)
Oh well. Here’s to eight months of trying to figure it all out.
Now that I’ve had a chance to process and digest the finale somewhat, I’m less in shock about all we learned about Jacob in the first flashback. We now have a rivalry (Jacob and Anti-Jacob) that’s been going on way longer than even Widmore and Ellie have been alive! But what I can’t figure out is how our existing factions (i.e. Ben, Widmore, Ilana/Bram, the DI, and our Losties) fit into this new rivalry. Presumably, the Others/Hostiles (and Richard, 70’s Widmore, 70’s Ellie, and Ben by association) were in the Jacob camp since they were following direction from him. And so is the Ilana/Bram group since Jacob summoned them to the island. But then that suggests that Widmore (and Ellie/Faraday by association) might have defected once they left the island and effectively joined the Anti-Jacob camp. This could explain why Widmore went out of his way to guide Locke after he left the island down the chain of events that led to his death and reincarnation as anti-Jacob. Or am I overanalyzing this too much and will season 6 just be everyone realizing that anti-Jacob and the smoke monster (I’m assuming they’re in league b/c of how they jointly manipulated Ben into killing Jacob) are the true enemys and unite everyone against them? I’m confused again! 
Jacob seems very benevolent so I don’t think he’s responsible for anyones death. Frankly that ben and Nadia’s killer were in the same place at the same time makes me think that ben was the one who made it happen.
I think Jacob knew in the past that all the characters he visited would be his salvation and the salvation of the island which brings 2 points for me.
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What’s in the guitar case? is it what will resurrect Jacob or somehow save the island.
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He never visited Ben so does that mean that those two men both had the power to influence the people on the island.
But, obviously I’ve got more questions than answers so here they are.
- Guitar case
- Is Hugo the replacement for Jacob?
- Why Christian Sheppard? Is Jack’s bloodline important? Claire, Christian, Jack?
- Fake Locke is obviously bearded guy, but what is his name. Biblically speaking an enemy of Jacob must be Esau. Which would kind of explain why Esau the hunter would’ve eaten already and why he affects Locke who brings a Boar to the camp.
- What did Riccardus(Richard) say in Latin and why did Ilana know his original name?
- Does the nuke actually stop the events which may or may not stop the whole timeline, but I feel that all these things were simply meant to happen and the fact that everyone chose to return to the island… Maybe a divergent timeline.
- Without Blondie will Sawyer pursue Kate again?
- Who? is coming?
I’ve been trying to figure out the same thing. Since the beginning of season 4, I have thought there was a “third” party so to speak (Team Ben, Team Widmore, and Team X). I often thought it would be the Dharma Initiative, still active from Ann Arbor. With Jacob and anti-Jacob now in the picture, hopefully we’ll find out how they are all connected.
For those who are curious: Richard’s response to Ilana, translated from Latin, was “That which will save us all.” My Latin is rusty (although I did kick sorry Barb in Latin in high school). Got this from Maureen Ryan’s tv column for the Chicago Trib.
I think we will find out that the bomb is essentially the same effect as turning the key was to Desmond. That key may have been attached to a nuclear bomb of it’s own.
If that is the case, maybe more of our Losties get unstuck in time like Desmond did and start going on mind trips to the past and future. That may be the next stage of the game who’s rules keep changing season after season.
After having a season of soft mysteries and spoon fed answers it feels really good to have some raw speculation to chew on again!
I’m looking forward to see Juliet running through the jungle naked.
it feels really good to have some raw speculation to chew on again!
I…never mind.
I think the season will start off with a time flash of “they’re coming” and we’ll soon learn that they are already there and are lead by Irina (even though she doesn’t realize her role in this as a tool for someone else’s means). We don’t even know if “they” are good or bad. Irina may work for Widmore, Anti-Jacob, or some outside force. Maybe Dharma is coming back with a vengeance. Maybe the oceanic 6 were a test dummy of how to find the island and get back. It makes sense that Irina was always in on it. Now we’ll have a whole group of people who’ll know how to get there, but are friendly to Richard and know the right passwords and handshakes. Maybe the island has always been divided by two camps, but Jacob’s was always the one in charge until anti-jacob figured out how to kill him (by using his proxy(Ben)).
I do think that we’re going to get a flash back of Jacob/Anti-Jacob and the nature of their relationship. We’ll also have to get the skinny on how Anti-Jacob came to use John’s image.
I’m excited to see Elizabeth Mitchell on the “V” remake coming up, but I fear this means that Juliet has indeed been written off of LOST.
'Course, it didn’t mean much for Katee Sackhoff on “Bionic Woman,” so here’s hoping.
- Hm. It would be insanely morbid if it were Charlie’s dead body inside. Though I suppose lugging that around would cause a back problem.
- I doubt it, but it would be insanely cool.
- I’m going to say no for this one. I think it’s important that both Christian and Claire are related to Jack, but I don’t think the bloodline and the island are related to each other in the past.
- My question is this: Since Locke 2.0 is this Esau dude, is Locke really dead now, or is he still somehow connected to Esau in his Locke body? If Locke is really dead, does this mean all the things that have happened to him on the island (walking, becoming a leader, blah blah blah) all manufactured by Esau to arrive at this point where he could ‘take’ Locke’s body?
- I have yet to care too much about this new group, but I’m definitely interested to find out their part in all this.
- I think something like a divergent timeline or a parallel universe thing is very possible. If the bomb isn’t a reset button of some sort, then…Hm. Isn’t everyone dead?
- God, I hope not. But with or without Sawyer, I still think Juliet’s one of the few interesting female characters on the show.
- Aliens?