GWC Podcast #209

Podcasts Galactic Watercooler
#61

Derivative = Cop Out (Bruce Willis, Tracy Morgan)
Homage = The movie The Lost Boys

Actually, I think homage is the wrong word here. In my mind an homage is a moment that is defined as a nod to something else. For example in Last Crusade when Indy is asked if he is sure if the image in the catacombs is the the ark of the convenant he responds, “I’m sure” and a piece of Raiders music plays in the background.

If you accept the fact there is nothing original out there and that everything is related to everything else then where do we draw the line between derivative and quality? Raiders of the Lost Ark is directly based on adventure movies from the 30s and 40s. Go and rent the best of them: Gunga-din. There are shots and sequences that are directly lifted out of that and dropped into Raiders including the getting dragged behind the truck sequence.

I would argue that something that breaks new ground and transcends the original to make something unique in an interesting way is the definition of quality.

#62

I love your Harrison Ford in the box sig. :smiley:

#63

Its from Air Force One right?:smiley:

#64

I was lucky enough to be in the room for that, and I’m amazed that clip is so short! It felt like they whispered forever, and everyone around me was holding their breath. Then we all gasped in unison when she confirmed it. And this was during the Stargate panel! That was my favorite thing about being at my first big convention - everyone there loved all the shows too, no one expected me to choose The One True Show. I could rush from DS9 reunion to B5 discussion to Stargate to Doctor Who & revel in it all … sigh.

Which is one reason I’m looking forward to the meetup so much! And I finally got all caught up with my GWC casts & can post here in a timely fashion. :smiley:

#65

A very well thought out post and one that I appreciate quite a bit.

A note on cavalry. The purpose of Cavalry is to find the enemy and then fix the enemy in place (dealing out quite a bit of destruction in the mean time) until more forces can be brought in to destroy the enemy. As such, every Army division has a cavalry squadron to do this job. In a heavy division, cavalry consists of a mixed force of Tanks, Cavalry Fighting Vehicles (in my time these were M3 Bradleys), and attack/scout helicopters. In a heavy division cavalry squadron, tanks provide the main fighting punch. In a light division the squadron consists of Humvees with a variety of weapon configurations (typically M40 grenade launchers, TOW missiles, and .50 cals) and attack/scout helicopters. In a light division the main fighting punch of the cavalry squadron comes from the attack helicopters. Of course I left the service a number of years ago so the equipment might be a bit different now.

#66

I’ve downloaded the past 2 podcasts, but I’m saving them, (along with this coming week’s 'cast), for my 17-hr flight to Japan next week.
Maybe next year I’ll the Big Meet-up.

#67

I think Sean or Chuck made the patently false statement there was no Volkswagen during world war ii. in fact, the company had a well known and intricate role with nazi germany. they built cars, war machines and machinery of the death camps. volkswagen is often referred to, in fact, as the “nazi car company” and

there are many websites about it. Here’s just one of them.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Hitler_and_the_Volkswagon

I love you, chuck/sean/audra. but too often you stumble into the abyss of ignorance about volkswagen, marian not needing to be saved in indiana jones, not knowing squat about dates, and other such things.

okay i have to say the goofy mixing of analogies that in a single sentence include citizen kane, the pile of steaming dogsh*t that was Transformers, and the Smurfs all in one sentence…it’s almost comic.

For the life of me, i cannot comprehend why anyone above the age of 9 or who lacks a severe case of Downs likes Transformers. It is so mind-bogglingly retarded i don’t get it. mind you, i’m a deep in the marrow geek. but it’s just stupid. obviously megan fox is a charming vixen.

but can someone say in a single sentence why Transformers is actually a good movie?? please???

#68

You know, I hope I’m not stepping out of line as a newbie round here, but I’m not sure this qualifies under ‘the friendliest people in Sci fi’.

ISTR the other week you were pretty sharp as well. From thread ‘Podcast #207’

Is this just some ironic humour thing that I’m not getting, or are you really this blunt all the time? If so, I think you’re taking this stuff just a little bit too seriously. Remember, in the words of the mighty Chuck “Oh yeah, and have some fun”

#69

Um, what???

#70

but can someone say in a single sentence why Transformers is actually a good movie?? please???

Some guys are into cars. Some guys are into robots. Some guys are into outer space stuff. -> All guys are into Transformers.

BTW, you remember “Volkswagen Abyss of Ignorance”? The opened for “Kara Thrace and Her Special Destiny”…

#71

Jonathan, your edgy style has been missed. Welcome back. You make two points.
[ul]
[li]Volkswagen existed during WWII[/li][li]You do not like Transformers[/li][/ul]You are correct the Crue made a mistake. Thank you for raising our awareness regarding the history of Volkswagon. The Hive Mind is a powerful thing and keeps everyone learning something new everyday.

Your second point requires a longer discussion. I encourage you to start a thread on the topic.

#72

This actually reminded me of an interview I heard where a musician was talking about the originality of another musician. He said the parts of the person’s music were influenced by other musicians, but the combination created something original.

Personally, I just don’t understand using “derivative” as a criticism of fiction. It seems to me to be like saying, “I don’t like cereal because it’s cereal.” I guess it’s legitimate to say, but it doesn’t tell me anything about what doesn’t work in the film or book or television show.

#73

And I have to return that originality does not quality make. There’s a movie out there called Jesus Christ: Vampire Hunter. I suggest you do not watch it unless you have no fear for your mortal souls. I’ve never seen anything like that before, it seems fairly original to me, but it hurts my soul (or what’s left of it) to admit I’ve watched it.

What is the mark of quality is the ability to take your material, whether it be an exquisite kaleidescope of snippets of your influences or something that is completely unlike whatever has come before, and to breathe life into it in a way that people will be able to take something back from it.

#74

Blarg, spent way too long editting this dumb post so Ill just get to the point already.
You call something derivative when the sum of its parts is unoriginal. The key to originality is in the formulation. You strip a volkswagon and rebuild it into something that isnt a volkswagon and voila! original. You strip a volkswagon, rebuild it but change the logo and the paint, and you have derivative. Doesnt mean you dont want to drive it, but it is what it is.
Sure, Firefly is really the movie Stagecoach with John Wayne, but its twisted and reshaped into something new and worthwhile.

PS. I tried to watch Jesus Christ: Vampire Hunter (sounds awesome right?!) but couldnt bear it; 15mins in and I couldnt take anymore.

#75

Derivative is when I like it. Unoriginal is when I don’t.

#76

Oh, you missed the true message of the second coming, Everyone Gets Laid Tonight!

My friends freshmen year of college had weekly movie nights that ranged from the awesome (Evil Dead 2 and Army of Darkness) to the questionable (JC Vamp Hunter) to the profoundly disturbing (Something I can’t recall the name of and don’t want to go into on the forums)

#77

OK, I’ll go part of the way there with you. I’d say a mark of a quality story is something that seems familiar enough to be real and unfamiliar enough to be interesting. Essentially I can understand the characters and the gist of the plot and setting, and expect the heroes will win, the guy will get the girl or his life will be, if not appreciably better, at least closer to enlightenment. On the other hand how it gets there is the interesting part.

If that makes any sense.

#78

Agreed! Awesome sig Solai. For some reason, it makes me want to play whack-a-mole really badly.

#79

I haven’t commented on a podcast in a long time but I was a little sad that Chuck was getting better. I enjoyed the “D.T” jokes from the last cast. :stuck_out_tongue:

#80

This is the best answer yet, or at least the most honest :slight_smile: