I caught it in the chapter JKR told about their history, but I also tend to feel that a person’s sexual orientation is totally irrelevant. It certainly doesn’t make Dumbledore any less important as a character. And, yes, JRK is going to be majorly flamed on this one.
The questions were pre-selected.
I have read all the books and greatly enjoyed each and felt that I read them with enough attention to get most of the ideas in there from the author. But no where in the books previous to the 7th and in the 7th I never had the idea that “hmm dumbledore seems gay” and even if I had it really doesn’t change what he was to the story. It would be different if dumbledore tried to do something with harry that no one got till now but dumbledore was just a really smart wizard who happened to have a really great friend who was also a great wizard and now she says he was gay. Its kinda out of left field. Just my opinion
“Make It Gay, Make It Gay…”
You all know this little ditty from The Producers? I can’t help but feel that this recent disclosure appears to have an agenda outside the relam of the story. I’ve read and re-read the books many times and saw nothing that would lead me to suspect this. Dumbledore had a job to do- getting Harry ready to fight- and that was bigger than him or his personal life.
If he is gay, then why not take the opportunity to have an important lead character (rather than the typical funny well dressed sidekick) be out? Love was Harry’s number one weapon against Voldemort. Dumbledore taught Harry about love. What a waste to have him loveless (other than the love for his students and truth) for seven books.
I doubt this “by the way…” approach will open any minds.
Maybe I’m out in left field here, but her announcement struck me as honest. She provided the background information to movie people in the same manner in which she has in the past – which has made the movies quite good. It didn’t go public until a girl asked her a specific question about Dumbledore, which she answered honestly.
I agree that it’s not critical to the story, which I’d guess is why it didn’t appear in the book. And I’ll admit to supporting the idea of being honest (but not explicit) with children when they ask about things like this, though I certainly wouldn’t argue with an individual parent’s decision to address it however they like with their child specifically.
I understand that homosexuality brings out a lot of emotions in everyone, but I think that when we take a step back from this, it’s not the big deal that it seems. I don’t know Ms. Rowling well enough to know if she’s a publicity hound, but from what I’ve read about her, she doesn’t strike me as one. Her hones answer will likely hurt her bottom line more than it’ll help it.
I read and enjoyed the whole series. She’s not my favorite author, but she’s a great storyteller, and some of the writing is quite good (in my humble opinion). I hope everyone will do their best to keep their emotions out of this and just enjoy the books for what they are: good fun.
In some ways Chuck’s comments remind me of the scene in the Family Stone (movie) where the Sarah Jessica Parker’s character was trying to talk to her fiance’s gay brother about bringing a child in the world with his partner and “risking the baby being gay”. It was horrendously awkward because she did not mean offense but was also practical about the fact that people who are gay face a tougher time in the world than those who are not. It’s not right and we should work to change it but that does not change the fact that we have not fully succeeded.
It was a rough scene to watch, for me, because I really think that she was trying to be honest and understand, but instead the family wanted to crucify her and she was being set up.
On track with the Dumbledore thing, I just don’t see it. Plain and simple. It doesn’t read with me.
I respect that she was trying to help the screen writers “get it right” but what does it say about her writing if by reading her books they were NOT getting it right?
Worse still, is that this creates a new level to the movie/franchise. This is a “fact” which will be part of all the conversations leading into the movie releases for #6 and #7. The actor will be asked what it’s like to play a gay man. Family groups will get airtime to decry/ praise “Dumbledore’s secret love”.
Interestingly enough, Harry Potter 1 earned 90 million it’s opening weekend. Harry Potter 5 only earned 70 million and I’m sure cost a lot more to make. Me thinks perhaps JKR is a bit more media savy than many are willing to admit.
I agree that honest is good and frank discussions about life and love in all it’s forms is the way to go. But I can’t shake the feeling, as others have noted, that this was imposed on the story after the fact. That Rowling wanted to “explain” why Dumbledore had no wife, why he was content to be a teacher, and an educator, but never a husnband and father. And she did that by saying he was gay. Something I don’t think she had to do. She could have easily left it at: he had greater things to love, or he never met the right woman, or He knew his place in the world and was content.
Nevermind the dialogue she provided about how she percieves men’s relationships makes me wonder how much of life she “gets” anyways…
shrug
I won’t to so far to say I reject this as canon, but I will continue to question her motives for this revelation for a while. The real test will be over the next few months, especially around the time of the Movie 5 release on DVD and the movie 6 release to theaters to see what else drops out.
Rorlins
what it says is that his sexuality was/is irrelevant to the story and that they simply made the assumption that he was straight.
and in regard to the actor playing dumbledore as gay, i don’t see why they would consciously do this, as, yet again, his sexuality has no relevance, and especially seeing that they’ve already made 5 movies where the actor playing dumbledore was not intentionally “playing a gay man”.
I have never understood why it matters…
I don’t go up to people and say, “Hi, I am Stephen, and I am Heterosexual”.
What I do in my bedroom, and who I do it with, is my fracking business…
If the homosexual community would stop trying to force it down everybody’s throat (no pun intended), then I am sure that they would suffer far less discrimination and backlash.
As a parent, soon to be, I would much rather teach my children my own set of moral values, then allow random parts of the media to handle that for me, but of course, it is my responsibility to “shelter” them from those avenues I don’t agree with, or would prefer they not be exposed until a certain age.
As an aside, I have never read any of the Harry Potter and have no idea who everyone is talking about, but figured I would throw my penny into the ring anyway. 
I buy it, and I remember briefly thinking that Albus’ relationship with Grindewald had a faint air of man-crush about it, but, as many have mentioned here already, it really had no relevance to the story, so it became a moot point that I quickly put aside in favor of the larger narrative.
For an interesting perspective from an author’s vantage point, check out Neil Gaiman’s comments on it. I was surprised and intrigued by his mentioning some of his characters that he considers to be either particularly gay, or something other than what they appear to be.
Thanks, Tigh’s Eye:
Neil G.: “(I remember being astonished when I learned a few years ago, from an obituary, that two teachers I’d had as a child were a same-sex couple. Mostly astonished because at the age where they taught me, I didn’t imagine that teachers had romantic lives, or were even entirely human; and learning that they were a pair reconfigured everything I knew about them, which wasn’t very much.)”
Exactly right. If you were an astute reader (which means you didn’t, as I did, dismiss these thoughts b/c it was a childrens’ series) you would have picked up on it. If not, no harm, no foul. In the end, it doesn’t really matter. The story ends the same, either way.
And as the story is told through the eyes of Harry (except for the obligatory opening chapter set somewhere else), we can see how Harry might not ever see his teachers, or at least the venerable Dumbledore as a sexual person.
On the other hand, teenagers see adults differently then elementary school children. My students, for example, know I’m a sexual being becuase they know my wife is pregenant and I’m in the “Carry your Cell Phone at All Times, Dangit!” phase of this process. So they know that much about me. Likewise they all know that a certain teacher is gay (or assume he is) since he’s not married and has had the same “roommate” for many many years.
Are these relevant to our teaching? Not particularly. Does Dumbledore’s sexaulty change the outcome of the HP books? Probably not. Might he have acted differently towards Harry if he wasn’t gay? Can’t say for sure. Perhaps he saw things in Harry that reminded him of Grindewald. Sure he’d never have sexual feelings towards Harry (ew ick, he’s a kid for crying out loud), but is it so far fetched to wonder if remembering the “sexual feelings” towards Grindewald would flavor how he interacts with a boy that is similar?
shrug
For the most part it’s a non-issue, that’s true, except if you question the how and the why of it’s revelation. I’m very cynical about all things Harry, mostly as I find the media circus attached to it a bit sickening. Now I’ll color that with the fact that I own a complete Hogworts Uniform, a complete Bill Weasley Costume, have worn both in public and honestly love the books.
What I don’t love is the … well circus attached to it. The “Midnight Marathon” of reading to be sure you learn all the facts before you can get spoiled. The media blitz of more and more Harry Hype as other great books go unnoticed by the Mainstream Media. I mean is HP really that much better than say the “Series of Unfortunate Events”? Or than “Narnia”? “The Golden Compass”? Or than… well… lots of other books for that audience?
As such I turn a very cynical eye towards this revelation by JKR, now that the book series is over, all the fans have their hard cover editions and people are starting to stock up on the “gift sets” and “complete editions”.
Perhaps it’s my latent cynacism and my general rejection of the non-cannon slash ships that flavors my reaction to this news.
Rorlins
I think that having Dumbledore be gay in the HP series isn’t a terrible idea, all in all. If this story detail shakes up some readers who ought to be shaken up, or starts some positive discussions, then this character detail served its purpose.
This didn’t bother me in the slightest, and since I don’t much care if someone I meet is gay or straight, it never occurred to me to ascertain Dumbledore’s (fictional) sexual preference.
When I found out I was like “eh oooookay” mainly because it was not in the books but a statement after their release(Correct me if I’m wrong) and also I never really cared about the sexual exploits of Dumbledore. Kinda thought he had a thing for Madam Pomfrey though.
You’re exactly right about the timing, and I also thought that was (at least a part) of why Pomfrey was kept around (and least until we got the full story.)
…
A few comments:
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It does matter that Dumbledore was gay as it characterizes his relationship (not with his students) but in his early life. That’s not crucial to the story, but it is revealing of the depth and nature of his feeling.
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It does matter if your friends are gay/lesbian, not that you treat them as inferior or perverted, but that you show an interest in their lives and relationships just as you would your straight friends. That’s the real desire, not a 'don’t ask don’t tell; scenario.
The only impact that I am aware of is that it impacts how JKR saw the character and wrote him, and nothing else, really, though it’s easily enoughs een in the very close relationship between Dumbledore and Grindelwald.
As far as how we raise our kids and the “agenda” and other stuff, I don’t know that this is where I’d discuss it.
My thoughts:
When Rowling said that Dumbledore was gay, I think we all had a picture of Dumbledore in our heads and then a picture of “gay” in our heads. I don’t know what you think of when you hear gay, and I’m really sorry if this deeply offends people, but what pops into my head is
San-francisco, Lisp, big-rainbox-tshirt, effeminent, pride-parade, walking-a-pink-poodle, out-and-flaming gay person…
As (unfortunately) many many many people , my impression of homosexuality is almost 100% driven by media, and most of that media is film, television and print. The above described is the person we’re left with.
When we heard Rowling say Dumbledore was gay, I think we had a hard time meshing the two pictures. The reality is that the two pictures don’t mesh. My response is that I’m not trying to make the two pictures mesh. To me, there’s nothing in the books or films that suggest homosexuality (or heterosexuality for that matter) of Dumbledore, and there’s nothing that really needs to. It never comes into play, and isn’t particularly important to the story.
I admit that to me, when the “announcement” (and it was hardly that) happened, it felt like a cheap shot at Rowling making herself to be daring and progressive. However, the interviews I’ve read, and what I’ve seen of her, she doesn’t strike me as that kind of person.
That’s not an uncommon perception, but it doesn’t really square with reality. Remember that the gay people who don’t do that are likely to go unnoticed. The gay activist community tends to have a large percentage of those people for the same reason that SciFi Fandom (capital letters–the people who organize cons, etc.) has a large percentage of uniform-wearing, filk singing, slashfic writing people. Those are the ones who are the most gung-ho.
The media representation is curious. Back in the Hayes Code days, there were a lot of homosexual characters, but they were kept subtle. There was a big spike in super-fem gays sometime after Stonewall, and now we have more of a balance. (e.g., Will & Grace.)
Dumbledore strikes me as more of a Peter O’Toole type.
I love that.
Now I have Peter O’Toole delivering Dumbledore’s line in me head. Grand!