Our Generation's John Wayne?

GWC Community Off-Topic/Other
#21

Great pick with De Niro! He generally plays a more devious character than Wayne did but he stays on point and is able to translate that to a variety of different types of movies. He fits my somewhat arbitrary start in the late 60’s career criteria. He’s got an Academy Award for Best Actor for Raging Bull. He’s got about 90 films listed under his belt through 2013. My only reservation with De Niro is the villainous characters he’s played. Wayne was definitely not known for that.

As far as westerns I was referring to Bruce Willis not being in any westerns, not Harrison Ford. I do count Ford as being in several westerns: A Time For Killing, Journey to Shiloh, The Frisco Kid and of course Cowboys and Aliens. That said I completely agree with Indy and Solo being equivalent and your argument that scifi films have replaced that genre today. Actions films - not wholeheartedly but a portion of them yes.

~Shooter Out

#22

John Wayne was his generation’s Chuck Norris.

#23

Kiefer Sutherland? Hmmm. Definitely has the action/western movie cred. I find his military films…lacking. They are there, but not exactly in the style The Duke did. Kiefer does have roughly 50 films to his credit, although there are a lot of voice credits. He does have some major awards, but they are for his TV work, not film. Like some of the other’s I’ve responded to already, Kiefer has a villainous side to him that doesn’t really fit Wayne’s style. I’m not sure his career marries up to John Wayne’s career.

Now Jack Nicholson. There’s a character. It turns out he is the most nominated male actor in Academy Award history. Jack has two Oscar’s for Best Actor in As Good As It Gets and One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s nest. Jack also has an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor in Terms Of Endearment. Nicholson won the AFI Lifetime Achievement Award in 1994 and the Cecile B. DeMille award in 1999. Nicholson’s other Golden Globe awards include: Best Performance by an Actor in a Motion Picture “About Schmidt,” Best Performance by an Actor in a Motion Picture “As Good As It Gets,” Best Performance by an Actor in a Motion Picture “Prizzi’s Honor,” Best Performance by an Actor in a Supporting Role “Terms Of Endearment,” Best Motion Picture Actor “One Flew Over The Cukoo’s Nest,” and Best Motion Picture Actor "Chinatown. Starting in 1958 Nicholson has about 62 movies under his belt. But Nicholson’s characters aren’t always stand-up like Wayne. As much as Wayne would have fit the role in A Few Good Men I could never see him playing it. Col Jessup was the villain and thought he was above the law. Wayne always respected the law for the most part. Nicholson is probably as big or bigger in the industry than The Duke was, being a driving factor in the Academy Awards themselves. As petty as it may seem Nicholson fails my somewhat arbitrary career start in the late 60’s criteria. So with all things considered Nicholson might be the better actor and bigger Hollywood mogul but I just don’t see him as our generation’s John Wayne. If you disagree with me I’d love to hear what you think!

~Shooter Out

#24

I did a Root Beer spit-take when I read this. Pure Genius sir!

So, are you saying that the reverse would be true? Are you claiming that Chuck Norris is our generation’s John Wayne?

~Shooter Out

#25

The more I think about it, in my opinion, there IS no this generation’s John Wayne.

John Wayne is just so so well known for his westerns that all his other work is overshadowed.

I don’t think we have in our generation an actor that was (a) Such a huge icon and (b) So type cast in a single genre (Westerns in Wayne’s case).

If I may go deep for a second here: I’ve had mixed feelings about John Wayne over my lifetime.

I used to enjoy reading a lot of books about psychology and such, and was very influenced by books that looked closely at manhood and what in means to be a man.
Books like Sam Keen’s “Fire In The Belly” and Robert Bly’s “Iron John.”

A theme of books like that would often touch on was that how John Wayne was really bad model for being man and manhood. The sort of “rough-and-tough, condescending to women, show no feelings” kind of man that John Wayne as a poor role model for modern men to follow.

So those views tainted my perception of John Wayne and I actively avoided watching his movies.

Then there came a point in my life where I really started geeking out about the Western genre. And started reading all the many many Louie L’Amour books and Larry McMurtry books and watching every Western movie
I’d not yet seen. After a while I realized I couldn’t avoid the John Wayne movies and watch some of them too. I was surprised to find they many were really good, and he was really good in them.
Hondo is probably my favorite John Wayne western of course because it’s based on a Louise L’Amour book.
My perception of John Wayne is more positive now. Yes he does represented an un-evolved period of American manhood and what it means to be a man, (Anyone in these modern days who acts John Wayne-like in reallife is usually a douche…and I know types like that.) but the excellence of his body of work is something to respect and admire.

Anyway, sorry to veer off topic. My geek tendencies force me to go deep on topics I have much to say about :o

#26

What the hell is wrong with you people? I’ve seen home movies of myself, and I’m pretty bad ass, in a “I should get paid millions to look edgy and buff” kind of way. I could totally beat Wayne’s ass if I needed to.

Well, maybe not. Dammit.

I like the Harrison/Eastwood take.

I so wanted to be Solo as a kid. (Still kinda, sorta, really do)

I have no idea where I’m going with this.

Cheers!

-Trey

#27

Trey,
I’m fine electing you as our generation’s John Wayne, but we must perform a Swagger Check on you.
If your Swagger level is 99.4 or above, you qualify. :smiley:

#28

I’ll throw out an outlier choice …

SAMUEL JACKSON

//youtu.be/ecc0nbg9m-8

OB

#29

Actually Last Man Standing is quasi-modern retelling of the classic Akira Kurosawa movie ‘Yojimbo’. Seriously… Watch one and then the other, they are nearly identical. And both awesome in their own right.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0055630/ (It is on Netflix instant watch)

#30

I would like to toss out Sean Connery, Jackie Chan, Robert Patrick, Ron Perlman (tongue firmly tucked in cheek) and Liam Neeson for consideration. They all have done a number of varied roles over their careers, and all have (even in their advanced years) played tough guys (some even villainous), and rather well at that.

But I would like to point out that we are making 10X the number of movies per year than what was being done in the 30’s-60’s. Premium cable channels and video rentals created a voracious demand for more movies, and so more studios sprouted up to try and meet this demand. Which means that more actors were needed to fill the need for more and more films, and tv shows as well… So we don’t see niche actors like we used to, playing the same style of character over and over again. And so I believe this is why we no longer are treated to the Bogarts, Edward G Robinsons, Cagneys and John Waynes of the past.

#31

Not true! Wayne is also known for this adventure films such as Donovan’s Reef and Hatari as well as his military films like The Sands Of Iwo Jima, The Flying Leathernecks, The Green Beret and The Longest Day. Wayne was also perhaps most noted for his non-western The Quiet Man even.

I cannot disagree that some aspects about John Wayne are a bad role model. But there are some good aspects too. Wayne was always striving for the betterment of circumstances, to build something greater than himself and to fight the good fight. We no longer see these qualities as often as we once did and it would be nice to see more of them.

Exactly. But back to your very first point, I do believe that there is a John Wayne of every generation. Someone who inspires greatness and hard work ethic. Someone who we love to watch on the big screen go through the challenges of our day.

I like Ford. Others like Eastwood so far. And there have been many others pointed out. Perhaps we all have our own Wayne. I’ll bet you have a favorite actor that sort of fits the bill.

~Shooter Out

#32

OB,

I’ll admit I’m seriously intrigued at this option. Sam Jackson is definitely a hard worker. Since 1972 he’s been in well over 100 films with more coming (I counted 105 so far through 2014). He’s been pretty shunned by the Academy Awards only having been nominated once for Pulp Fiction and has only 3 Golden Globe nominations as well. Jackson often plays the same character just in a different setting. He’s not a one for one with Wayne because of his acting style and parts but he’s pretty close. I’d be interested to hear other’s opinion on Samuel L Jackson as our generation’s John Wayne. He very well might be the best fit.

For now I’ll still stick to Ford.

~Shooter Out

#33

Wow! What a list! Here we go…

Sean Connery. Amazing actor. Plus are you aware that Connery and Wayne actually worked the same film once? Bonus points if you can tell me what it is. However, like Eastwood Connery started in the mid 1950’s - not exactly our generation.

Jackie Chan. Turns out he’d be a pretty good choice too. When you think Jackie Chan you think the quirky, hard working, ass-kicking, working for the good side sort of character. He was a child actor in the 60’s so I’ll give him a pass on a pre mid-60’s start. He has no major American awards to speak of but has a Hong Kong Film Professional Achievement Award in 2005. He has an amazing 150 films. Jackie Chan might very well be a replacement for my Harrison Ford choice.

Robert Patrick has the action and military films, but I just don’t think he’s got the notoriety of Wayne.

Ron Perlman. Really?

Liam Neeson. I wanted just to brush him off but I can’t. His roles have been too similar to each other and to Wayne’s. He’s got 65 movies and started in 1979. Definitely on the short list.

It’s interesting that you brought this up. I ran across an article this morning that was saying something similar from the actor’s perspective.

However, I think with the various excellent choices given so far GWC has proven that while you can’t get exact, you can get close!

~Shooter Out

#34

I have a couple thots to add.

First I think you may have to loosen up on the villain problem. Acting careers just don’t allow for niche characters. If you want to be big you have to be diverse. Also, actors are way more artistic about their craft than when Wayne was making movies, for various reasons. Mostly because they get more work that way as well as who wants to do the same thing all the time if you don’t have to?

Sam Jackson, it hadn’t even occurred to me, but I think he’s got to be on the VERY short list. He has done’a variety of characters throughout his career but he hit on the one that works for him best with Pulp Fiction. Best of all he knows it. With Snakes on a Plane, he’s the one that came up with the tag line. He knows his audience & he knows his character.

Also, yes Wayne was known for his action roles during his career. Now? He’s known for westerns, for the more knowledgeable, war movies. That’s about the extent of the public’s familiarity with his work now.

#35

Some people become niche actors because of their lack of talent and ability, and others because they become comfortable in that role. Wesley Snipes is obviously very comfortable playing the same role over and over. Jackson obviously has the chops to do whatever he likes, but seems to gravitate towards the same style of role time and again. George Clooney is a classic case of the former model turned acxtor, he knew his limitations and so always picked roles that he felt comforable doing and so were the same (for yeeeeeeeeeears…). Until he grew restless and felt he needed to branch out; he honed his skill and finally started doing other roles, and now he is finally being recognized as an true actor, and not a former model.

But yes niche actors are very rare, they usually are former models, martial artists and comedians. But some blossom into competent actors and move on, while others feel content to be one-trick-ponies. Which is fine, if you enjoy what you are doing go for it! But studios crave actors who are versatile and have drawing power, those are a sought after commodity both here and abroad.

#36

How about Morgan Freeman? Robert Duvall? Dustin Hoffman? Robert Redford? Paul Newman?

#37

This was one of my first thots when I saw this thread. I always thot of John Wayne as John Wayne not as Rooster Cogburn or John T Chance or Ethan Edwards. When you’re watching a John Wayne film you’re watching John Wayne. In that vain, I think you could make an argument for Arnie or Jennifer Aniston.

Ok. Ok. I know you’re thinking that ole frakkintalos has lost it. Walk with me. Name one Jennifer Aniston film where she doesn’t play Rachel from Friends. She is the same in every role. Even Horrible Bosses, I know someone is going to bring that up. She is Rachel off her mess in that film. If you’re watching a Jennifer Aniston film it’s because Jennifer Aniston is in it. Same with Arnie.

Anyway, I’ve never thot of John Wayne as a man’s man and I never wanted to be John Wayne. John Wayne was John Wayne. I wanted to be Captain Kirk…or Bruce Lee. Even better Captain James Bruce Lee Kirk.

#38

Jeebus, it’s uncanny Talos how I always seem to find myself in total agreement with you.
Yes! That’s my perception of John Wayne too. I’ve always seen John Wayne as John Wayne.

Ergo, John Wayne is Jennifer Anniston. I’m with ya.

#39

Yeah, I think my problem is I haven’t seen enough JW movies …and hence I assoicate him very narrowlly with Westerns. I guess it’s also fair to say he’s a cultural symbol representing “America” is a certain way…not necessarirly all good, nor all bad. Was he more Movie Star than actor? That’s unfair but I’d say there’s element of truth in that.

I guess if I HAD to pick my this gen’s John Wayne is Liam Neeson. Harrison Ford is too stratospheric for me to indentify with, whereas Liam Neeson’s hero characters I indentify with. Rob Roy. Qui Gon. Darkman.

That said, when I see a Liam Neeson movie I believe him as the character. But John Wayne on the screen, I just think of him as John Wayne.

#40

That is a fair assessment, since he was pressed into doing propaganda films during WWII in an effort to help with morale back home, and remind everyone what we were fighting for. He even did a propaganda film during the Vietnam war as well… So generations of people grew up with him representing our culture, our cause, kind of an avatar for what America supposedly represented. The silent tough guy who would not start a fight but damned well would finish it…

I think he was relieved when he could choose his own roles later on. Which brings up another point now that I think of it… Actors back in the early days of Hollywood had no representation, and little power or say in what films they did. Which would also explain why JW did not branch out and try new roles until much latter in his life, he had no say it early on. And by the time he could try and do so he was so frakking typecast it was hard to break free of it. (Kind of like what happened to Kurt Russel, everyone saw him as that ‘kid from the Disney movies’…)

And if you did try and exercise a little say in what films or roles you did, or God help you if you attempted to form a union; you were ‘blacklisted’! And no studio would touch you.