9/2009 Winner: John Scalzi, "Old Man’s War"

GWC Community Book Club Winning Nominees and Polls
#41

So I sat down and read through it. Very engaging prose, and excellent story. I’m looking forward to reading the sequels.

Something I found very interesting was that I didn’t feel like I was reading military sf - which for me is good, as I rarely have patience for it. The concepts Scalzi’s talking about are fascinating, and it was no effort at all to suspend my disbelief (brain transfer? downloaded… but without goo tubs!). I particularly enjoyed that we were discovering the way that the CDF etc worked alongside John, as the people on Earth know as little about it as the first time reader does, which made it exciting to learn about new things, rather than having to drag ourselves through a lecture (which, apologies to those who love him, is how Heinlein comes off to me).

As a happily married person, I really liked John’s explanations about why he missed marriage the most of everything on Earth. :slight_smile:

Bender (was that his name?) reminds me of a number of classmates I’ve had in grad seminars. If only the rest of us had those clubs… :wink:

#42

Don’t feel bad about Heinlein. Those who love him know he’s preachy.

#43

I think the amount of preachy you think Heinlein is, is inverse to how much you agree with him.

Like Starship Troopers or Moon Is A Harsh Mistress don’t come off as very preachy to me, cause I concur. Stranger In A Strangeland on the other hand, very preachy

#44

Agreed that the writing style is very relaxed, and homey. You almost feel like you’re sitting with Perry and he’s relating his past to you. Not alot of techno-babble either, just enough to get you by. And my gods can Scalzi write with humor! The book has a lot of heart as well.

The first chapter was a wonderful setup, and really let you know right away what kind of guy Perry is: down to Earth, quick-witted, pragmatic, and thotfull.

I think I realized I was hooked when the first of Perry’s “Old Farts” was killed in action. It stopped me in my tracks me for a moment.

I’ll agree with others here and say I found a lot of satisfaction in politico-turned-soldier Bender becoming a puddle of goo under the onslaught of 40,000 some-odd projectile needles. He had a bit of the right message, maybe, but he was just too damned annoying to bear!

I’ve already gotten and read (well, listened to on Audible) Ghost Brigade and am almost through with The Last Colony! I know I’m jumping ahead, but I couldn’t wait to see what happens with Perry and Sagan, as well as Zoe. I’d highly recommend John Scalzi. :slight_smile:

#45

Over the summer, I dug through the GWC Book Club forum, and this is one of the books I picked up at the library. I loved it. I blew through it in 2 days (It would have been one if it weren’t for that pesky need to sleep)

I feel your pain. I don’t have nearly as much time to read as I would like now that school has started.

#46

While I prefer my Military SF a lot more gritty and immersive (I am a big fan of David Drake’s books), I actually enjoyed the book.

To me the book seemed to deal far more with Humanity, personal identity and what it is that makes us human, than with warfare. Which I found oddly refreshing, it was not a ‘Starship Troopers’ or ‘Forever War’ clone, but something new and different.

I enjoyed the intellectual journey of ‘what is it that makes us…US?’. If the only thing human about you are the memories of your previous life, are you still human? And what about the Ghost Brigade? They awoke in their nonhuman bodies with NO memories, and yet consider themselves human. Child warriors in adult bodies, instead of adults in child bodies ala ‘Sky Crawlers’.

The characters were not stereotypical and I found them interesting and actually cared about what happened to them.

This is probably the first military Sf book I have read which focused more on the characters themselves than on the hardware, strategy and fighting itself. Very different, but I am not sure if it is enough to make want to read the next two books. especially after some of the comments I have have read.

By the way, am I the only one who kept thinking of the upcoming ‘Avatar’ movie while reading the book? :wink:

You must admit there are some parrallels…

#47

finished this morning. the end had me in tears. got started right away on Ghost Brigades. good choice, Hivemind! :slight_smile:

#48

I’m listening to the book again tonight, from the start. Reflecting on the book as a whole, I find the premise that the Colonial Defense Forces have Earth in pretty much a complete media blackout as far as knowledge of the universe around it pretty interesting. The CDF has all the tech, all the info, and controls all the space travel, while the Erf is handed a few tidbits of news and tech…just enough to wet the appetites of elderly would be space-fairers and entice them to sign up. The fountain of youth has always been an effective carrot to dangle.

Rather than being the revered home of mankind, Earth in this novel becomes merely a supply house for colonists and soldiers who take a leap of faith into the unknown upon leaving their home world. It’s importance lies more in the fact that it has a huge populace ignorant of the fact that the universe, well, seriously sucks. And that populace is used to both colonize the galaxy and defend those colonies, with absolutely no say in decisions made. Quite the scam, and a great play on today’s government conspiracy theories.

#49

Old Man’s War was the September/October 2009 Book Club Selection; check out the discussion here.

#50

For what it is worth I have begun to refer to OMW as my new Ender’s Game. I enjoyed it so much I tore through the sequel Ghost Brigades and am now on the final pages of The Last Colony.

What I realize I respect Mr. Scalzi for is that he has not once rested on his laurels. He has created an elaborate universe filled with incredible tech. In the first book he introduces the world and the book is essentially a love affair with the green body and brainpals. (I won’t spoil anything moving forward, don’t worry). The second book in general jettisons most of the tech talk and takes a different focus on different characters becoming more of a conspiracy mystery. The third book jettisons everything again and takes an entirely different yet interesting focus.

Purposely vague, everyone knows how I feel about spoilers. The feat of Scalzi’s writing is that in my mind he could have written three sequels to OMW that followed exactly the same characters in essentially the same type of situations. He didn’t, and the results didn’t suck.

That is impressive. I will be picking up Zoe’s Tale this lunchbreak. I can’t believe it has taken me this long to discover Scalzi.

#51

It’s cool, he did the reverse of most authors. He started at the Universe level, moved down into the Squad level, then moved down into a community level. Also Zoe’s Tale is really, really good. Might be better than Last Colony.

#52

I loved this book, and I’m really happy that the book club gave me the push I needed to finally get it out of my to-be-read pile. I’ve been wanting to read it for a while—ever since I listened to a John Scalzi interview on Mur Lafferty’s podcast. I thought he was interesting and funny, and I hoped that his book would be too. I really love being right.

I liked Scalzi’s conversational style, John Perry seemed very authentic to me from the start and I liked the character’s sense of humor. He took the time to give his characters real weight—which I love—which makes me care about each person. Even Original Jane, who dies before the beginning of the book, has a presence.

I actually laughed out loud at so many moments but I think the best one has to be when Perry meets my favorite character: Master Sergeant Antonio Ruiz.

“Don’t think I don’t know what you’re thinking, you dumb shits. I know you’re enjoying my performance at the moment. How delightful! I’m just like all those drill instructors you’ve seen in the movies! Aren’t I just the fucking quaint one!”

“. . . You’re under the impression that after a few weeks of training, my gruff but fair façade will begin to slip and I will show some inkling of being impressed with the lot of you, and that at the end of your training, you’ll have earned my grudging respect. You’re under the impression I’ll think fondly of you while you’re off making the universe safe for humanity, secure in the knowledge I’ve made you better fighting men and women. Your impression, ladies and gentlemen, is completely and irrevocably fucked.”

Oh God, I laughed so hard I cried. I’m laughing right now.

I don’t have the math to critique Scalzi’s science but it felt plausible, and I liked how he explored the practical, military, and social ramifications of the technology humans might have access to in the future. I’ve seen sci fi authors use concepts like consciousness transfer, BrainPals, and genetically engineered bodies before, but with John Perry I felt like I was experiencing those things first-hand. I could imagine myself being in a squadron with Perry and struggling to cope with a new reality, like he did.

One of Perry’s major issues (which I found particularly fascinating) was his fear of becoming a soulless killing machine after the attack on the inch-high Covandu. I’ve actually met people who have been in the military who’ve talked a little about having to carry that burden—and I have to say that I’m not confident of my ability to be able to come out on the other side of that. The idea that I’d have to go out to exterminate other races is horrifying. But the thing that I found even more disturbing is the idea that Perry’s self-disgust is something that every CDF soldier goes through and then gets over, like your conscience gives one final kick before it dies for good like a dead squirrel on the side of a highway.

I liked this book so much that I went out and read Ghost Brigades, The Last Colony (which were both great), and I’m starting in on Zoe’s Tale. I’m now officially a fan of Scalzi’s and I can’t wait to see what he puts out next.

#53

Hi Nike! Agreed that the Perry meets Ruiz scene was hilarious. And the payoff at the end, with the tattoo and the advertisement penned by Perry that saved Ruiz’s life: Laugh out loud funny. I don’t know if you experienced it with Audible.com but the vocal actor they had to play Ruiz was pure over the top Drill Sargeant, absolutely perfect!

I too have read a bunch of Scalzi since the GWC Book Club made its choice, and am a huge fan now. Try The Sagan Diary too! Told from, yes you guessed it, Jane’s point of view and just as touching and awesome as the others.

You’re the Woof, aren’t you? :stuck_out_tongue:

#54

Hey, Topgun! A wolf? Never. I am a villager for life!

#55

I picked up OMW at the library on a lark a couple of weeks ago. I didn’t realize that it was the book club selection. Great choice!

I was hooked immediately when I realized that John Perry (as well as Scalzi himself) lived outside of Greenville, OH which is about 20 minutes north of where I grew up.

The parallels to Starship Troopers are definitely there (there is a mission that is strongly reminiscent of the first combat action in ST), but Scalzi puts a different spin on it by making it a character-driven story as opposed to action/combat. No combat suits, but they are more than made up for with the upgraded bodies and the BrainPals (I REALLY want one of those). Again - he humanizes the story, even though they are significantly altered, they are still human beings. Even the SF troopers in highly modified bodies that in no way resemble a human body consider themselves just as human as anyone else.

If you like your aliens cute and fuzzy or you think there’s a diplomatic solution to every problem, this book is probably not for you. It’s a dangerous universe humanity has found itself in and Darwin is most definitely the driving force. The moral aspects of this are explored in Ghost Brigades to great effect. Why is Earth isolated? Why are it’s inhabitants kept in the dark about the danger humanity faces? The answers are disturbing and thought provoking. Is the Colonial Union truly on the side of angels or is it just another power-hungry government trying to maintain the status quo even though it may be jeopardizing humanity’s very existence? Great stuff!

Dave

#56

I have a paperback copy of the OMW, if someone would like this copy please send me a mailing address and I will drop it into the mail. Otherwise, the book will sit in a pile of books for goodness knows how long. :slight_smile:

#57

I read OMW, Last Brigade, and Last Colony over a span of 4 days during the winter holidays (5 days if I include the second EVE Online novel).

For background, I came to GWC after the EVE Online/honorverse podcast. So, the last GWC book selection (and books in general) I read were the first nine novels of the honorverse series over 12 days. After the fourth or fifth book, I was reading them purely to get a conclusion to a major plot arc. When I reach a semi-satisfactory conclusion, I put the rest of the series on a do not read list. Still, I am curious about how the story is turning out. But, I cannot bring myself to pick up another honorverse novel.

I’ve also read the two EVE Online novels currently available since that time. This is me just saying in a long-winded fashion that I’m not really a reader. I have an ADHD when it comes to reading (less so for anime series). I have to read a novel in one go. If I put it down for too long (like to go to sleep), I may never come back to it unless it really held my interest. Even though I’ve had The Hobbit for over ten years, I’ve never finished it. ):

So, I say all that for you to understand me when I say I want more of the OMW universe. I loved the humor and character interactions. The past holiday will be the most memorable in part because of those novels (and extended family members surviving a bad car crash).

I went and ordered the hard cover editions of Zoe’s Tale and Sagan Diary. I’ve had them for over a month. I’ll have to set aside two days to read them in one go. But I know once I read them, there’s no more OMW!!! ): So, they may sit until the next time I visit family.

Thanks for making this selection. Because of my particular AHDH (if that’s really what it is), I have to be very finicky when it comes to buying books. I found the premise intriguing and took the plunge, and I’m very grateful I did! The way some of you compared OMW to Ender’s Game, I may give that a try someday. (Please don’t banish me for that statement.)

#58

Like you fastcart, I hadn’t read any Scalzi until hearing of him via GWC, and after reading his stuff couldn’t believe how great it was and how I’d ever missed out on it. If you have Audible and want to take it a step farther, the narrator that reads Scalzi’s works is awesome, totally (imho) captures that Everyman vibe…highly recommended.

Reading your post puts a big smile on my face, remembering how much I loved discovering this book series.

#59

Ironically, Scalzi is most famous for this.

Story here.

#60

Highs and lows. I saw that picture and was at a high. I started reading the comments which led me to Oolong, the bunny with a pancake on its head. Found out said bunny died. I was at a low…