#257: Artificial Intelligence, Part II

Podcasts Galactic Watercooler
#21

The language thing made me think of this:

I think we need to assume that any definition of AI has to inherently include a definition of intelligence. Whether or not something occurs naturally or by man-made means isn’t very relevant. Something is either intelligent (read sentient) or it isn’t.

From there is where all the questions come. The reason the “artificial” part comes into play is that it affects the discussion and reaction that follows. In our society we gain ownership of things that we create. But to me, something that is sentient cannot be owned. Post-Renaissance philosophy has brought about the idea of God-granted (or natural, if you prefer) unalienable/inalienable rights (life, liberty, property). So when a sentient alien comes about, we (I hope) assume that the extra-terrestrial has said rights.

But if we create a machine/device/thing that is sentient, can we endow those rights upon them? Asimov seems to imply that we could, but we won’t (the 3 laws restrict liberty and life). On the other hand, in “I,Robot” there’s discussion of the Positronic brain being a thing of complete mystery to the engineers that produce it…

So that’s my take. if it’s sentient (and that I really can’t define), it doesn’t matter if it is natural or artificial. What matters is the discussion that comes after that.

There’s a book I read last year called “His Robot Girlfriend”. It’s a book about an AI that ends pretty happily. Give it a shot:

#22

fascinating casts, I had two sets of points to make, one about AI development (on a personal level) which I’ll leave as a voicemail (hint hint) and the other one more of a jokey thing and also a comment on the license fee.

RTE (our national TV and radio channel) have a similair and yet differnt set up to the BBC, as with the UK we Poor Irish people are forced to pay a License fee if you own a receiving device (as it happens I DVR a lot of RTE so I’m good with it). There’s little or no home grown sci fi TBH however RTE, due (according to them) to the small number of subscribers/ populaiton here (around 1/12th of the UK) are also funded by Advertising. This has lead to the one private TV channel, justfiably in my opinion, complaining about “double funding”, they get the license feee and advertising revenue. Think what you will, it’s the model we have.

A quick jokey comment on the man/woman sex thing, if your ear is itchy and you put your finger in to scratch it and twiddle it around in there for a bit, what feels better afterwards, your finger or your ear? :stuck_out_tongue:
Phaze
on the “I date Sean to read that last bit out next cast, daaaaare” ID

#23

Love the cast. This arc is just too much fun.

By the way, Guillaume is the French version of William.
It’s like Dominique and Dominic :wink:
Just wanted to let you know :slight_smile:

#24

Normally Astromechs only are built to communicate with machines, but when we hear R2’s sounds, we can basically understand what he’s trying to convert. As you mentioned on the cast R2 squeaks and beeps sound like what a baby would do. Well that is the case, because Ben Burtt (The sound designer) was trying to “say” R2-D2’s “lines” or expressions like a toddler with his own voice and ran it through an analog ARP 2600 Synthesizer.

Regarding the use of analog vs. digital methods for example in films, even though such movies like the LOTR Saga or Star Wars Prequels are very digital effects heavy, they still used miniatures (Orthanc) or models like for Utapau in ROTS:

Of course the digital technology gives you more freedom, but to be able to touch the “world” you wanna portray, some old methods won’t die in the next decades IMO.

We also have to pay a fee in Germany which goes to the public-service stations by everybody who has a radio, TV set and since a few years PC or mobile phone with internet access “ready for use”. Which means even if you only have the device in your house not plugged in, you have to pay. Most of their earning are used to get the broadcast rights for big sports events like the Olympic Games or Football tournaments. And in contrast to the UK-version, over the last 20 years more and more advertisement has been included in the program.

#25

Great 'cast, guys. I just want to clarify one thing. Oklahoma does not have any snowplows, we wait for the 60 degree days that normally follow immediately after a snowstorm. Who knew it would be winter for more than a couple of days at a time?

#26

Re: Babies and language - Kai, my son is 19 months and it’s amazing how much comprehension and understanding you get from him even though he has a limited vocab. Even when he was younger and I’m sure other dads can prove. You just understand what they want. Language and communication is such a powerful thing.

#27

Great cast! I’ve been listening for a few months and that is the one that finally gets me to register. :slight_smile:

An interesting definition of intelligence is found in the book On Intelligence, written by Jeff Hawkins, and can be summarized as the capacity to make predictions of the effect of our actions. I like it because it’s simple enough to covers a broad range of intelligence level and can actually be observed and measured. Can sentience by proven?

I’d like to comment on the first part, about Sean’s comment about an AI needing to be “pro human”. I think that would be just as catastrophic to western civilization as an outright hostile AI. We’re kinda leaving 80% of humanity in poverty and I doubt that would make sense to an AI intent on a “Greater Human Good”. Author Tony Balantyne solve that problem in his book Capacity by making all AI intent on an equal share of life for every life form. The book is interesting as it also deals with what happens to a digital copy of yourself after it’s created. (It has equal rights to the “original” and exist on its own).

As can be guessed, I don’t see a fully sentient AI as a very good prospect to our continued existence. I think the concept of the Technological Singularity is something that needs to be addressed or else, we’ll simply end up as an other evolutionary step toward a digital AI.

Possible Asimov – Foundation spoiler below

Before I forget, not sure if it counts as a good outcome to human/robot relationship, but Ari Seldon’s wife (I forget her name) in the Foundation cycle could be an example of a good relationship. I’ll admit it did end up badly for her in the end. Asimov’s robots are probably a special case with their Laws tho.

Now I need to find where to post my introduction topic…

#28

The payload:

The delivery system:

The Strategy:

When offering up ones self for quick fame and audio favors it helps to keep said deal, secret, hence the power bribery. But now the word is out… and well, it appears I’m something of a tart.

The plyable man-candy available at cut rate prices. My life is a sham!!! A sham I tell you!!

#29

Welcome Kolia! And great post btw!

#30

You can do that in the (Un)Official Introduction Thread

And Welcome.

#31

As mentioned before, my first awareness of A.I would be D.A.R.Y.L (Data Analytical Robot Youth Lifeform). That had a decent ending that had the main boy living out his life with a family that loved him.

I would consider the robots in Batteries not Included to be a form of A.I so they don’t always have to speak.

As I mentioned on Twitter last night, I think there will be opposition to A.I that look like us in the form of religious grounds (i.e. Making beings in our image should only be the realm of gods - therefore are we trying to be gods).

Would we ever want A.I in the position of power (president, prime minister) or head of a major Corp)?

#32

D.A.R.Y.L.! Awesome flick. When I saw that movie as a kid I thought stealing an SR-71 was the coolest thing I’d ever seen. I remember trying to put together my own plot to do so which I figured would fail due to my inability to find a dash one for it. (Hey–I was a kid. Cut me some slack. :slight_smile: )

Fun movie though.

#33

I’ve read The Bicentennial Man novella by Asimov but the movie just for some reason didn’t appeal, maybe it was the belief no adaptation could do the source material justice or I still had issues at the time with Robin and his more straight acting work.
Either way one of those movies I don’t think I’ll ever watch.

#34

I too can attest to the amazing ability young children have to communicate even before they are capable of speech. Lily at 17 mos knows quite a few signs in ASL that her mom has been teaching her which really helps. When she’s hungry she can just make the sign for eat. However, she has learned that if she keeps making the sign for eat then we will attempt to keep feeding her and won’t put her to bed. Apparently, parents have to keep on learning too. Anyway, she is in this stage where she points to everything to just to hear what the word for it is. I bet she’ll be speaking soon.

I like to follow some of the research on animal intelligence and it always generally unimpressive when it was said that species X (be it chimp, dolphin, parrot, dog etc) had the approximate intelligence of a 2-3 year old human child. However, now having experienced fatherhood I know that to be quite significant.

#35

Hi, first-time commenter on the podcast here.

Regarding the discussion about the BBC’s content versus American broadcasters, I agree that the BBC really seems to create content that is unique and it probably has a lot to do with the business model. I’m not sure how that contrasts with cable networks like HBO-- I’m not really sure where most of their revenue comes from-- subscriptions? Ads? DVD sales?-- but I think the ABC/NBC/CBS/Fox model will be changing.

I saw an article on Salon.com regarding an American remake of the BBC’s Prime Suspect. I’m a huge fan of this series and highly recommend it, but I agree with the author’s assessment of the problems with adapting it to American TV. I’m told that The Closer takes some inspiration from Prime Suspect, but I’ve never watched it. There was also a short-lived series on ABC or CBS in the mid-90s that centered on a female police detective that seemed to be inspired by PS, but I don’t remember the name. I think the detective’s name was Rose. Maybe someone else remembers it?

Anyway, here’s the article from Salon:

#36

I’ll second that. Squeak is only a year old and her vocab isn’t big either but she points and makes motions and does actions that are perfectly understandable. You can also watch her sight-line and see the wheels turning and what she’s going to do. Pretty freaky.

#37

I’ll second that. Squeak is only a year old and her vocab isn’t big either but she points and makes motions and does actions that are perfectly understandable. You can also watch her sight-line and see the wheels turning and what she’s going to do. Pretty freaky.[/QUOTE]

<linguistic geekiness>
Yep, the efficiency and speed with which kids pick up language is crazy. To this day, we aren’t quite sure how they can do it, but we do know that it’s radically different from…say…an adult trying to learn a second language.
Back in 1965(ish), Noam Chomsky came up with this concept of the “Language Acquisition Device,” which he thought of as some sort of innate processing capability in the brain of human children that allowed them to construct a mental grammar (the lexicon & morphological/syntactic rule set) incredibly quickly. The idea was that it was most likely some unique feature of the structure of a brain in early development, and that eventually it diminishes as a child grows, explaining why new language acquisition gets progressively harder as you get older.
</linguistic geekiness>

#38

I think its a case of a young childs mind is primed for accepting new information, the connections are in the stage of growth. it’s basically a fresh brand new hard disk. Information is easy to obtain. Adults brains are ones that have been written over, defragging hasn’t happened in years and our sectors are going bad :).

What’s even funnier with kids is the conversation they must be have with you as their body language (aka the hands are flying everywhere in expression). I must do a video of Kai sometime in the near future :).

#39

!!! How did I miss out that they’re trying to do a remake of Prime Suspect?! I loved that series. Well, love, I still do. How could they possibly try to replace Helen Mirren? hmmm…

(and hi! welcome!)

#40

Okay so; this is the first time I’ve done this. If I am out of order, I do apologize. I’m not sure if anyone else out there has pointed this out yet; however, when Audra (briefly) mentioned Robert April as being in the original Star Trek pitch as captain of the Enterprise, the name rang a bell in my head. I did a little digging and there is an episode of “Star Trek: The Animated Series” enrtitled: “The Counter Clock Incident” in which Star Fleet Ambassador-At-Large, Commodore Robert April shows up. It is also mentioned that he was the very first captain of the Enterprise (preceding Pike). You can watch the episode (and the whole series, I think) on YouTube.